Agenda – Select Board Agenda September 5 2023

Official Minutes – Not yet released.

Please note this automatically generated transcript is unofficial. If you find an error, use the contact page to notify Plymouth On The Record.

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okay the time being five o’clock and this being Plymouth select board I will call to order this the first portion of

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the Tuesday September 5th 2023 uh meeting of the Plymouth select board the

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select board will hold an executive session pursuant to Massachusetts General Law chapter 30 a section 21A

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Clause 6 to consider the purchase exchange lease or value of real property if the chair declares that an open

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meeting may have a detrimental effect in the negotiating position of the public body we will be covering 158 Center Hill

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Road lease and 30 Town War fleece the select board will also be holding an executive session pursuant to

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Massachusetts General Law chapter 30A section 21A Clause 7 to comply with or act under the authority of any general

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or special law or Federal grant and aid requirement and will reconvene an open session at the conclusion of executive

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session we will be approving executive session minutes for March 28 2023 and

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April 18 2023. do I have a motion to go into executive session to cover these

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two matters that are permitted for our executive session motion Mr Helm has moved I’ll second Mr bletzer has second

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any discussion about whether or not the select board should go into open into executive session hearing and seeing none I will go

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through the role Mr bletzer how do you vote I vote Yes thank you Mr Helm yes Mr Mahoney

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and I vote Yes so we will go into executive session we will convene back an open session at the conclusion of the

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executive thank you

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the time being 6 28 pm and this being the Plymouth select board I will call to order at this time this the Tuesday

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September 5th 2023 meeting of Plymouth select board please join the board for the Pledge of

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Allegiance pledge allegiance to this

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Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and

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justice for all

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all right uh this meeting of the Plymouth select board is happening in a hybrid format we have members of the

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board joining us physically at uh Town Hall here at 26 Court Street in the Great Hall we have one member of the

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board that may be joining us in a hybrid format over Zoom um we are working on a technical issue

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with that and we will see what the resolution is but members of the public who wish to view this meeting or

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participate in it are welcome to come to 26 Court Street to the Town Hall in the

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Great Hall and watch us here or participate here at public comment and that section of our agenda or you may

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log on to zoom and participate there by watching us on Zoom or by participating

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in public comment on Zoom our Zoom login information is included on our agenda and this meeting is being conducted

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pursuant to changes made to the open meeting law in response to the covid-19

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pandemic all right so that brings us into our agenda proper we are going first and

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foremost into a public hearing we have one moment

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read the notice into the record in accordance with chapter 138 of the Massachusetts general laws as amended

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notice is hereby given that a public hearing will be held at the Plymouth Town Hall 26 Court Street on Tuesday

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uh September 5th at 2023 at 6 pm to consider the

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application for an all-annual and annual all-alcohol restaurant license from kkd’s Incorporated doing business as P

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Papa’s Pizza Bar 38 Main Street Extension Plymouth Amy Hurst manager

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description of premises is as followed single floor with kitchen dining room and bar additional seating outside on

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the sidewalk against the building handicap accessible men and ladies restrooms as well as a staff restroom

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one entrance and three exits anyone wishing to be heard on this matter should plan to attend this meeting

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all right I will declare the public hearing open at this time do we have

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anyone here to speak on behalf of the application please come to the microphone and

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identify yourself when you arrive yes please

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I’m Keith Staten the owner of kkd’s burger bars I want to apologize I miss

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the missed the last meeting it was in the hospital for a couple days with Lyme disease

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perfect for the area anyway what we’re trying to do is if everybody knows we’re moving the Main

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Street location over to the new Papa Gino’s building oh somebody seen it which is I think it’s fantastic is that

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new location has 50 parking spots which is good for most people they don’t want to walk uh 15 minutes for a burger

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so drive in and join the place so but anyway over in the 38 main street we

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have a lease on the facility we don’t own it we the Unity Club owns the facility over there so we have at least

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for another two years and then I have an extension for another 10. so what we’re going to do is we want to convert it

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into a buy our pizza style pizza like like a poop sees everybody knows poops

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he’s a Linwood of Venus where you can sit there and have a drink and enjoy it we’re not doing what all we’re doing is

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moving we left the equipment there the tables are there the seats are there we might paint it differently and get a

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pizza oven that’s it we may add uh so we’ll do the same thing we’ll just have just we’ll replace some

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burritos with pizzas I mean the same people same everything so that’s what we’re trying to do

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okay I believe we are uh joined at this time if I could one moment uh by member

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of the board uh Richard quintal our chair Mr quintal can you hear us yes Kevin thank you all right would you

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like me to continue chairing would you like to uh take the gavel from me no you know what um

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all right thank you dick I appreciate that all right uh so the record will reflect that Mr quintal has joined us at

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6 33 p.m uh thank you uh to the applicant for uh that introduction do we

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have any questions from the board uh for the applicant Mr helm

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thank you for coming in by the way sorry sorry for your reasons

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it’s a good good reason though but not a good reason on the drawing that we have

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in our materials okay I don’t know if you’ve seen it or not but yeah yeah yes okay it has black lines through that

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Edition that you all put on you know you took over the space next door a few years ago yes their black marker line

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are you yeah what I what we did is they wanted a a layout of the seating so there’s no seating on that side so I

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kind of cross that out okay so I can just show the seating okay but the kitchen’s gonna stay away

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okay are are you still going to have like the pickup yes in that through that

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doorway on that side yes okay the only thing we’re not we won’t deliver uh uh

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again as everybody knows there’s a pizza place beside it called Stevie’s Pizza and we’ve talked to them they’re happy

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as can be because they’re a Greek style and they kind of take care of the Brazilian type business you know

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location so but they’re happy because they think we’re gonna draw with people so we’re not going to do

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a delivery at all because I don’t want to you know go into their territory but we’ll do Uber and you know drop you know

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GrubHub and all that stuff but yes we will have that area yes thank you welcome

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all right Mr bletzer hey Keith how you doing good first of all great you up over on uh Samosa thank

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you sir I’ve been watching I’ve been in there a few times it was good and uh all of a sudden when you stick at the

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outside it looks beautiful yeah so I I can’t wait to see you get open there so

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basically we transfer it Katie’s license over to Sam assist yes yeah we went

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through the plan first so you so you keep them the same you keep them the lease on the other building two plus ten

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and you want to change your concept to a pizza bar and but you need a liquor

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license yes so we’re giving you an all-out called liquor license so that’s what you’re here for yeah you get a

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liquor license yes yeah we transferred the one we had here we

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trans we had to go through the license yeah that’s all done yeah that’s done sure you’re not open no oh no no no so

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you’re waiting to get a transfer a new license yes Pizza Bar yes and uh you’re

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asking for looks like you need a common factor lip uh the group one with radio

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and TV at one o’clock license and you want the early yeah there’s no

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entertainment license no no one said no no we’re not going to do anything nothing outside well we I think I think

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we applied for the um for the outdoor seating which in front of the sidewalk right but I’m

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finding out that the town may not do that next year I was going to say that that so in that case we would probably

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apply for the uh you know on the street whatever that’s called right but we weren’t we weren’t

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going to do it we were just going to use the Outsource outside seating but at the time that’s not before us right now yeah

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okay right so that’s so uh okay so that’s clear yes okay great and then

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obviously we can’t open I I anticipate that being sometime November I mean over there so you know

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we obviously have to have a license for this stuff you can’t open till you get the license that’s right well you could but you could probably only sell pizza

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I’ll learn how to cook it right right so uh all right great good luck thank you

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any other questions from any other members of the board

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all right do we have anyone here uh to speak in favor of this application other

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than obviously the applicant see no one in person Anthony anyone online

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seeing none do we have anyone here to speak in opposition of this application

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seeing none in person Anthony do we have anybody online all right uh if that if there are no

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other questions from the board there are not um I can close the hearing

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we have two we have Associated licenses that are requested common vicular comprehensive

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Entertainment Group one radio TV extension of hours 1 am early Sunday sales at 10 A.M we could do separate

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motions for the annual all alcohol and then do the other ones as a group or we

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could have one motion to do all of them together pleasure the board Mr bletzer I’d make a motion to approve everything

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together second all right it has been moved by Mr bletzer it has been seconded

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by Mr Mahoney any discussion Mr Helm I just want to make sure that we are not

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voting for outdoor for that outdoor component you are not we are not okay

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any other discussion seeing and hearing none I will call through the vote for the vote once again

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alphabetically through the role yes no or abstain when I reach your name Mr bletzer how do you vote as to this I

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vote Yes Mr Helm yes Mr Mahoney yes Mr quintal

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yes and myself yes it is unanimous thank you can I have a quick question that is

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since that outside CD Now is not included so I just apply next year when it comes around next year yes

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also you’ll go through the same process you did okay Mr Helm would you yeah you’ll be notified that you’ll be

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notified that process next year has not been determined and it may be totally different

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um than it has been during covid or the last two years um and it most likely if it’s different

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it will involve application to the ABC okay thank you very much thank you all

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right thank you all right that brings us into licenses and administrative notes

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first we have a number of licenses from PCO hope Plymouth Public Library

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Foundation stellwagon beer company and second wind Brewing Company uh do we

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have any questions from the board as to any of these

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I’ll move those four as a group second all right Mr Mahoney has moved the licenses as a group Mr bletzer has

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seconded any discussion from the board as to whether or not we should approve these

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licenses hearing and so on yes Mr quintal

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uh the second one Bruin on

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the Holmes field preservate preservation reservation what

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what is that about that’s uh stellwagon Beer Company

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uh at homes uh do we have anyone from stellwagon beer company present

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does anyone have any further information um Town manager perhaps on this specific

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request Mr

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bletzer I I looked into that I talked to Lisa about that and it’s the

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the Holmes field reservation committee is putting this event on for the Field

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of Dreams which is a it’s a non-profit

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I think it’s a chill some kind of children’s benefit I believe

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and uh but it’s it’s it’s the uh reservation folks that are

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involved with doing this so because I asked the question it’s not it’s not uh

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Town property it’s uh it’s in control of this reservation and they’re the folks

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that are putting it on so because I was concerned I was a Marshfield company that was doing the beer I asked about

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why is it not a local you know Local Company like second window or Mayflower assembly local but

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uh but it’s their event it’s so we have no control on that

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so anyway I I was satisfied after talking with the license uh Lisa Lisa

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Johnson I was satisfied with it Mr gwentel any other questions no thank you Mr Helm

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um dick while uh Charlie was was talking I looked it up it’s it’s online so I

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Googled it um it’s homes reservation um partnership with an Art Collective

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um it will be a art installation uh fall craft fair

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um fun activities um for instance get an Autumn temporary tattoo or have your face painted live

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music grab food at a food truck sit beer from stellwagon beer company and have a

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picnic on a peaceful field overlooking the beach

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thank you Mr helm uh any other questions from any members of the board as to any of these

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permits hearing and seeing none I will call for the vote once again alphabetically

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through the role Mr bletzer how do you vote I vote yes thank you Mr Helm yes Mr

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Mahoney yes and Mr quintal yes and I also vote Yes it is unanimous

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we have approved those four permits that brings us into the next section of our

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agenda that being administrative notes we have a total of 18 administrative notes listed on the agenda first and

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foremost are a number of meeting minutes does anybody have any uh questions on

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any of the administrative notes or anything they would like to add edit alter or otherwise change in regards to

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any of the meeting minutes that are proposed to be approved

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hearing and seeing none I will say that I having joined the board in uh

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on May 22nd was my first meeting of 2023 so the meetings prior to that I would be

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abstaining from I was also absent for the August 8th meeting because Derek and

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I were in shishikahama Japan about to embark on our 18-hour return Journey so I was not

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present for that so I would prefer to take one through seven and ten

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separately does anybody else have any meeting minutes that they need to abstain from that would require further

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subdivision all right seeing none do I have a motion to approve administrative notes one

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through seven and ten motion all right it’s been moved by Mr

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Helm any second second move and seconded by Mr Mahoney any discussion as to

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whether or not we should approve one administrative notes one through seven and ten

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hearing and seeing none I’ll call for the vote Mr bletzer how do you vote I vote yes thank you Mr Helm yes Mr

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Mahoney yes Mr quintal yes and I abstain all right so we have

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approved administrative notes one through seven and ten that brings us to the remainder of the administrative

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notes those being administrative Note 8 through 18 with the exception of administrative Note 10 uh do I have a

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motion for those Administration I’ll make the motion Mr bletzer has moved do I have a second

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Mr Mahoney has seconded has been moved it has been seconded any discussion as

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to whether or not we should approve administrative notes 8 through 18 with the exception of 10 which has already

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been approved hearing and Mr hell uh just really

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quickly just um for the town manager um number 18 uh the proposed amendment

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to the Personnel code is only the changing of the word director of Health and Human Services to Commissioner of

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Health and Human Services

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yes that is one of the proposals oh okay I see there’s also the chain this is

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just change of titles for exactly um deputy director of Public Works to

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assistant deputy director so we have an assistant deputy director changing it to

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Deputy these are just our systems title changes right okay good thank you

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and uh one of the positions deputy director of Public Works is going from an em8 to an em-9 right that’s right but

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other than that all right any other discussion

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hearing and seeing none I’ll call for the vote Mr bletzer how do you vote as to administrative notes eight through a

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team with the exception of 10. I vote yes thank you Mr Helm yes Mr Mahoney yes

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and Mr quintal yes and myself yes it is unanimous

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all right that brings us past that into our host Community agreement from hidden

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wonders LLC oh

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have anyone I see we’ve been joined on the zoom uh are you here for this

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particular item s we have Scott Rubin Scott Rubin

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all right uh you you have the floor please introduce yourself for the record

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here on behalf of uh hidden wonders LLC I’m here behind me

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um in my office here with Paul and our end he’s the principal um of this uh

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proposed uh new licensee for what we hope to be a retail and Manufacturing

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marijuana facility at 27 Robert J Way Unit 1 in Plymouth my client has been

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working extensively with your child attorney along with Steve soda who was

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the principal in the existing project he had a host Community

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agreement had received approvals from the zoning board for

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special permit to locate what was to be a larger complex that’s going to include

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cultivation which approximately in retail at one time he decided some time ago actually I

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believe he obtained his special permit back in August of 2022 and had decided

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that he wanted to move in a different direction Mr Marion has entered into an agreement

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to um transfer that host Community agreement through to him obviously we wanted the

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stipulations of his special permit was that any uh change of ownership more than 50 percent would require further

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approval from both the zoning board and um from the select board and so we have

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worked extensively with the town manager’s office as well as on how

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Council to come up with what we think is a fair draft of the host Community

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agreement my scientists find it and we hope that this will be the first

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of several steps on the way to this project which um my client again

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has extensive experience in marijuana retail it currently owns and operates a

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location here in Brockton where my office is located has been doing that for over two years two and a half years

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now very successfully and wishes to bring that experience to to employment

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um we provide me a letter to the slack board as well as sort of an outline of

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the security and um business plan we essentially have

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adopted what this board has previously approved and what the Zoning for improved would only modifications would

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be that we’re reducing this project by about 50 percent the original project including both one in units one and two

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we’re reducing it down to unit one and we’re only uh we’re dropping the

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calculation end of uh this project as well and I think Mr Marion’s a good fit

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for Plymouth again he has extensive experience has been one of the longest operators in the city of Brockton uh

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with his current location runs it effectively and seeks to be a good neighbor and they’re coming to put it

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and with that we certainly would entertain any questions that the board has uh relative to either his experience

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for this particular project all right thank you attorney Reuben any

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questions from any members of the board

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no seeing and hearing none I use that requirement a comment okay would you like to make a

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motion first so we can get into discussion sure I’ll make a motion that we approve this all right anyone cared a

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second second has been moved by Mr bletzer seconded by Mr Helm that we

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approve the host Community agreement and Mr bletzer you had discussion

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yeah I just have some comments about I was in business in Brockton and I was

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lucky enough to meet the Marion family and I can tell you they have probably one of the most reputable families in

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Brockton and met himself years ago and when I

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heard he was coming to Plymouth with this project I was excited because I know

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I know what Plymouth is getting they’re getting somebody that is uh is reputable

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honest We’re not gonna have I know that marijuana legalization of marijuana has been kind of controversial

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but I know that they’re going to follow the rules you know right to the T and I

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can tell you they I know they’re going to be good Community uh leaders and I I

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know they’ll get involved in the community because that’s what they do that’s the kind of people these folks have so uh I just want to let Plymouth

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know that this is a great a great family and it’s going to be they’re going to do

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it it’s going to be a very reputable business in Plymouth so I’m all for this thank you

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thank you Mr bletzer any other discussion from any members of the board

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hearing and seeing none I’ll call for the vote once again Mr bletzer how do you vote I vote yes thank you Mr Helm

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yes Mr Mahoney yes Mr quintal yes and myself yes it is unanimous thank

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you attorney Reuben appreciate you being here thank you that brings us into uh the

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next portion of our agenda is commercial shellfish license requests say that three times fast we have a maximum of

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five licenses for a trial basis until December 31st the named

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would-be licensees are on the agenda and we are joined by Mr Chad Hunter

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Harbormaster Mr Hunter thank you for the introduction and good evening

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um so just want to quickly discuss the five commercial Razer licenses that you have before you uh if you remember in

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early April uh we were I was here before the board to amend the town of Plymouth

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shellfish regulations to include Provisions for commercial shellfish Harvest

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um initially it was just for mussels but we also added Provisions in there to allow for other species including razor

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licenses we had some discussions with all of the the five listed applicants

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even going back to 2018 right before we had a an FDA Wastewater die study in the

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harbor we kind of put it on the Shelf until we got through that process because we weren’t sure if any of the

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classification areas would change after that die study last winter Dave Hobson inquired about

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commercial razors as well and he sort of pulled that off the shelf and we started to talk with not only Dave but Michael

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withington Sean withington Don Wilkinson and Ralph Savery again to see if we

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could get this off the ground and up and running um commercial razor clam Harvest it’s

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really it’s not a full-time job but rather it gives these individuals the

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ability to diversify a little bit three of the applicants are aquaculture

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Growers they have Farms they raise oysters and they’re looking to do this to diversify a little bit and Dave

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Hobson’s also a lobsterman in a commercial charter boat operator as well so he’s looking to maybe do this in the

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off season as well razor clams they’re not typically targeted

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recreationally so usually people are looking for surf clams soft shells quahogs so this is one species that you

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know we don’t want to impact the recreational fishery that we have and I think we can do so and not sort of take

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away from that Plymouth has very limited areas that are open and approved to

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Shell fishing so we want to make sure we strike that balance between recreational and Commercial

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um the the licenses if approved they will be active until December 31st 2023

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the commercial license fee established for the commercial muscle was 300 annual

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for residents 500 for non-residents all of the applicants are residents and I

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would recommend that we keep these commercial razor clams resident only Fishery

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uh the license would allow them to dig up to four bushels which is about 40

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quarts per bushel per day in shellfish classification areas that are listed as

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approved or conditionally approved per the division of marine fisheries shellfish classification areas

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minimum size of the razor clam is four and a half inches [Music]

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and I think we do have two of the applicants here if you had any questions for them or myself I’d be more than

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happy to answer those thank you any questions for Mr Hunter Mr

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Blitzer hey Chad how you doing they have a question what do you do with the razor clams

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um so they they would sell them for market and I think as we see in a lot of

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the other Fisheries people are starting to get clever and work with species that

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were not necessarily um dishes that you would expect to find in a restaurant I can tell you like

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redfish and some of the fish that used to be bycatch they’re actually you know

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looking to utilize those species because there’s not the limitations on them like Cotter haddock so this is very similar

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to that I know of some of the Boston restaurants have started you know using

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razor clams in in ways that wouldn’t necessarily have been done in the past and I think that’s you know partly

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there’s a bit of an abundance there and you know they’re trying to to use a food

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source that people might have used for bait years ago but that’s because I that’s what I thought it was so yep yeah

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I’ve heard of people using them in chowder but like I said they’re you know

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they’re they’re kind of using them in different ways and I guess if you get a good Chef you can do just about anything

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thank you thank you well I remember years ago muscles right nobody ate

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muscles they were plentiful and they you know it’s uh so okay great thank you

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thank you we used to sell uh we used to feed prisoners Lobster uh Mr Mahoney

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Chad so you’re issuing these licenses on a trial basis to see if Plymouth has enough razor clamp stock to support a

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sustainable commercial Harvest so you don’t know that right we don’t know that now

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um I think we have a pretty good indication that there’s uh there’s some limited areas that would support commercial it really depends on the

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frequency I mean obviously you have to pick your weather you have to pick your Tides these guys obviously have to have

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a market for razor clams as well where um you know that that can be the

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limiting factor and that’s what we’ve seen on the muscle side too if nobody’s willing to buy the muscles you’re not going out to harvest them so the same

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applies here with the razor clams so it’s gonna so why are we only going right now with

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a less than four month experimental time frame I think the fall

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is a pretty good time to to be out there shellfishing and you know I mean ultimately I think it gives them the

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ability to kind of jump start this and see where we are I would say probably at the end of the calendar year we take a

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look at um you know obviously talk to the the commercial Harvesters see what they’ve

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found what they’re running into they required to keep like a log book of how much they catch and when they catch it

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and yep so they do have to report monthly their Landings so whatever they dig and harvest would be reported back

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to the town There’s also state forms that they have to file so I’m not

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going to be necessarily picky about that we could ultimately just adopt that and use those forms but we would have sort

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of a track record as to how the Harvest is going um and then obviously get some feedback

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from the Harvesters as well so who’s the ultimate decision maker with respect to

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it is sustainable and we will continue with this in 24 and Beyond so as the

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shellfish Constable for the town that’s my other hat that I wear and obviously the the board has the authority to issue

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these licenses I think that’s a consensus that we come to when these guys are up for Renewal uh in

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24. so the next license if we deem it sustainable and we move forward is the

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next license going to be for the calendar year of 2014 correct yeah we were trying to keep all the commercial licenses on the calendar year so

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everybody would uh in the same in the same fee of 300 bucks correct yeah okay

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all right thank you thanks any other questions from the board

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if no one else does uh Chad you mentioned what’s the amount that they

34:09

can take is it a daily amount or a weekly amount daily amount and they’re allowed uh four quarts per day so 10

34:18

gallons uh yes I I looked at a couple of

34:23

you know what does a bushel look like four bushels so

34:30

um a bushel basket is almost like a a smaller size like laundry basket you’ll

34:36

see them on fishing boats quite a bit um apples and things they put in bushels

34:41

so yeah that’s and my understanding was it was about 40 quarts per bushel

34:48

and as many razor clams as they can fill into that volume yes they can keep okay

34:54

all right thank you any other questions before I

34:59

solicit a motion hearing and seeing none do I have a motion uh

35:05

to approve the licenses as listed Mr Mahoney has moved second

35:12

Mr Helm has seconded any discussion as to whether or not we should approve these licenses as presented

35:19

hearing and seeing none I will call for the vote Mr bletzer how do you vote I vote Yes

35:24

thank you Mr Helm yes Mr Mahoney yes Mr quintal

35:30

yes and myself yes it is unanimous thank you Mr Hunter thank you that brings us

35:35

into the next item on our agenda that being the municipal aggregation program presentation we are joined by Patrick

35:41

Farah energy officer Mr Farrah

35:48

foreign so I’d like to

35:55

just kind of go over very briefly uh Plymouth Community Choice power

36:02

supply program so uh simply stated it is a program

36:07

where the state allows municipalities the opportunity to hire a consultant to

36:15

go shopping on behalf of that municipality to look for the best pricing or most stable pricing for

36:24

residents and small businesses for their electric supply this has nothing to do with

36:32

transmission and delivery that is utility owned and that’s where they make

36:37

their money so real quick just where we uh where we are

36:44

right now we are finishing up the our second three-year

36:49

contract it is with Dyna G we’re at 9.807 cents per kilowatt hour this

36:57

contract will expire October 1st of this year

37:03

residents are encouraged to look at the energy switch website just put energy

37:08

switch.com or dot gov and uh just Google it and

37:14

you’ll see it and it’ll show you all the different companies and the pricing what they have for this area

37:24

so from the start of

37:30

our contract our second contract through the first quarter of 2023

37:37

um we’ve averaged about 23 338 meters that’s per month so the vast

37:45

majority of residents are on plymouth’s program

37:51

and you could see the the pie chart showing between residential commercial industrial street

37:58

lights

38:03

and since the first contract which started in October 2017 through March of

38:10

this year the community has enjoyed a 30 plus

38:15

million dollar savings now this is not through the municipality this is for all

38:21

residents and small businesses so we’ve been one of the most successful

38:26

towns with this program in the state

38:34

all right so where do where are we going as of July of this year through December

38:40

of 2023 eversource basic rate for Supply is 16.0 cents per kilowatt hour

38:48

for those who don’t know eversource goes out every six months to look for pricing advertises it in

38:57

late November early December for the January through end of June time period

39:05

and then goes ahead and advertises their summer rate that’s their winter rate and then

39:11

the summer rate starts on July 1st and usually they’re advertising around end

39:18

of May or early June so for this six month period we’re at 16.07 cents per kilowatt hour for basic

39:26

service as of October 1st of this year

39:33

Plymouth will be entering into a new contract with constellation new energy

39:38

it’s a 24-month contract and unfortunately the price is going up from

39:46

9.807 to 14.813 cents per kilowatt hour

39:52

however if you remember on the previous slide we’re still short or below the

39:58

16.07 cents per kilowatt hour that’s basic rate for eversource

40:05

now what’s also uh changing is that the town will be offering only one product

40:12

and it is a hundred percent renewable energy product when we engaged with our

40:17

consulted Colonial energy they took a look at all the different

40:22

pricing options and we went with the lowest price which is essentially the

40:29

same for a standard product which would have a combination of dirty fuel such as

40:36

oil coal Natural Gas um and renewable energy sources

40:43

so this program for two years will offer 100 renewable energy

40:52

and as before residents and small business owners can still opt in or opt

40:58

out with this new contract with no fees and or penalties and this is any time

41:04

during the contracted period so if I encourage residents and small business

41:10

owners to take a look around go on the energy switch website and if you find

41:15

a a better price because again the town does not guarantee the lowest pricing we

41:22

try to get a stable price for a period of time and offer real value to the

41:29

resident and small business owner

41:35

one question that has been asked a lot through our office is by residents is

41:42

what do they have to do with this new contract and the simple answer is absolutely nothing if you’re on

41:50

plymouth’s program right now you will be automatically transferred to the constellation new energy contract

41:56

there’s nothing that you have to do at all

42:02

and um anyone who’s interested in opting in if you had another third party uh contract

42:10

or if you were on basic service and you would like to opt in into plymouth’s new contract or if you found

42:19

a better price and you want to opt out Simply call colonial power that’s our

42:25

consultant at 866

42:31

-485-5858 and you just hit extension one and then you asked to be placed on

42:37

plymouth’s Community Choice power supply program or opt out

42:44

and I’m here to answer any questions and thank you so much for your time thank you Mr Farrah Mr bletzer do you

42:49

have a question for Mr Farrell Patrick how are you doing I just got I got something in the mail today about this

42:55

yes yeah it all went out on the 30th can you tell the folks out here and at home

43:01

how they can look at their bill and see if they’re aren’t doing any curious or not sure thing so when you uh receive

43:10

your bill a lot of people are now receiving it electronically just go to page two and you um everyone’s bill will

43:18

be split up into two components Supply charges and delivery transmission

43:23

and you take a look under Supply charges and under or just to the right of

43:29

supplier on that right hand column you should see the company that you are receiving your

43:37

supply from it’ll either say eversource basic service it’ll say dynagey or if

43:43

you have a specific third party that you’ve already contracted with in the

43:48

past okay so if you’re in Community Choice it will save you it’ll say dynergy right

43:55

now and then you’ll see constellation new energy next month at that rate

44:01

thank you thank you any other quite Mr helm uh Patrick a question now understand

44:07

this question is coming from somebody who majored in anthropology not electrical engineering

44:13

how is constellation from my understanding of the electric grill grid

44:18

it just fills up and we draw from it how do they guarantee if I sign up for this

44:25

the electrical flowing into my house is going to be only that from renewable

44:33

resources through uh it’s called renewable energy credits so consolation

44:38

purchases of huge blocks of renewable or green energy

44:44

and then that it’ll will the electrons come from the renewable energy source

44:51

maybe maybe not a component of it will however the purchasing block and we as

44:57

residents and small business owners since we’re contracted through that company they will use that block of

45:04

energy okay but that may not be the energy that is flowing into our homes the actual electron flow is not

45:11

guaranteed can’t do that all right um pretty good for an anthropology major huh yes um however just and you brought

45:19

up a good point Mr Holmes is that the the more demand for renewable energy

45:25

there is uh the greater that the industry will react and

45:31

um we all know or at least most of us know that we are in a climate crisis and we need to move forward and stop using

45:40

as much fossil fuels as possible my pitch thank you

45:46

thank you Mr ferret any other questions uh Mr quintal your digital hand is

45:51

raised thank you hello Mr question I uh I have a question

45:58

on street light Street lamps if you will I see they’re on the chart here also but

46:03

there’s a number of them oh um how can we get that corrected and

46:10

you know how does that work uh contact my office

46:16

contact me and I will get my 10 best guys on it

46:22

okay corner there

46:27

down to 7-Eleven if you will there’s seven in a row one of them’s at the

46:34

intersection there’s three in the industrial park from the PMB garage on

46:40

the right to the also to the other intersection I mean I only bring it up

46:46

because I travel it all the time and it’s like well you know they might be busy they might not have caught them but

46:52

I mean you can’t miss it so if you could start with those that’d be good now keep my eyes open and other residents keep

46:59

their eyes open excellent uh chairman quintal uh can I

47:05

reach out to you tomorrow and you can give me exact locations thank you

47:10

all right Mr bletzer yeah Patrick on that subject I’ve heard

47:18

that chairman Quinto asked that a few times about the street lights is anybody does anybody monitor them to keep track

47:25

of what’s out and in replacing them I mean that’s that request has been made at several

47:32

meetings I’m not trying to put you at this point no no that’s that’s fine so uh I presented before the board

47:40

um we’re across town especially in the downtown area which is very important with the tourists but he’s talking about

47:46

health mining areas too that it’s important too so how do we get that under control

47:53

it seems with repairing street lights it seems like a simple thing if something’s oh you address it

48:00

so what the audience needs to know is that the vast majority of the street lights all these what’s called a cobra

48:05

head is typical street lights um the vast majority of them over 2 600 of them are owned by eversource so if a

48:13

resident or someone sees it they need to call or email eversource it’s a

48:19

cumbersome uh operation so as staff as a courtesy

48:25

to the town I will reach out to eversource so it’s ever source is there

48:32

is the issue well for many of the lights but not all the lights we have downtown lights all

48:39

the ornamental lights in downtown the Town Elks and whenever there’s a problem DPW is there to react okay all right

48:46

thank you but if we act regardless of who owns them if we reach out to you

48:52

you’ll fix it one way or the other I will do my best all right

48:57

thank you any uh any other questions for Mr Farah related to the municipal aggregation or

49:05

street lights all right no vote needed uh do you require you do not I don’t know this is

49:12

just an update to the board and to the audience all right thank you thank you

49:17

very much appreciate it all right so that brings us into the next section of our agenda which is a

49:24

number of fall town meeting warrant articles that we will be reviewing first on the list is Article 5 it proposed

49:31

bylaw Amendment related to blight and nuisance prop and or nuisance properties on property

49:38

and we have Nick Mayo inspectional Services director joining us Mr Mayo

49:45

good evening for those who didn’t hear I’m Nick Mayo the director of inspectional services

49:52

what you see before you is a draft proposal think of a nuisance or blight

49:57

bylaw if you will I don’t know which term is less abrasive so they’re kind of both in there

50:03

um this bylaw basically boils down to a consistent issue that a lot of

50:08

municipalities struggle with is you have your state jurisdictions that are

50:15

that trickle down to designees of the Town say the building commissioner or the State Building Code or the zoning

50:21

act or zoning bylaws the health director with title V and sanitary code regulations the fire chief and the fire

50:28

code well a lot of those pretty much all those regulations fall short in some

50:34

fashion of specific things that may happen from time to time in the municipality that

50:41

cause either a public safety issue or a nuisance or blight that kind of degrades

50:47

surrounding property values and causes problems in neighborhoods well these types of bylaws this kind of bylaw is in

50:53

the intent is to fill in those gaps those gray areas those shortfalls of the state jurisdictions as well is to

50:59

support them um so the way it’s written is drafted in a way to do those things is support

51:05

those State and jurisdictions that are delegated to local officials as well as fill in the areas where they might fall

51:12

a little short all right thank you Mr Mayo any

51:18

questions from the board for Mr Mayo in relation to article 5. Mr helm

51:25

Mr Mayo in several um areas you mentioned

51:32

something called quote the enforcement Authority what is the enforcement

51:39

Authority that’s a great question in section two enforcement Authority is defined so

51:46

um it’s basically boils down to either the director of inspectional services myself or anyone I designate out of my office

51:53

the I think the fire chief and the health director in any of their

51:58

designees so there’s some it’s a little broad term to allow the town to have a little flexibility okay

52:04

cool thank you I I miss that in my review but I do have a question

52:10

um um 137-5 violations

52:15

could you explain that in detail not what the violations are but where it

52:22

begins if the owner fails to remove such nuisance within the time frame provided

52:27

which in 137 4 is 10 days the enforcement Authority may enter the property and remove or cause would you

52:34

explain the Cascade of of enforcement

52:41

yes to an extent so this is still somewhat of work in progress given the

52:47

community has never had a nuisance blight bylaw before um

52:52

this is a setup to allow an easier Avenue for the town to actually correct

52:59

a violation a problem we consistently have in the enforcement world it’s very difficult to actually get a violation

53:04

corrected what I mean by that is we have there’s appeal opportunities for anyone who is

53:12

in violation a lot of times there’s Court action that needs to be taken prior to because the other regulations

53:18

are not set up for the tolerance for the municipality to Simply go in and fix it

53:23

this is the start of that Avenue to allow the municipality the enforcement

53:28

authority to actually with a funding source to actually spend money correct

53:34

the violation and then recoup those expenses the path to do so we’re still working out

53:41

with Council it would commonly look like something of the cease and desists will go out in the form of the violation give

53:47

you the 10 days if it’s not corrected within the 10 days another notice would likely be sent out to notify the

53:54

property owner that on such and such date the town will rectify the problem

54:01

mind you all the appeal opportunities here are to a court of competent

54:06

jurisdiction so likely anyone who challenged these types of things or if we chose to take Court action in some

54:13

case it would likely be Housing Court given the majority of the issues that

54:18

happen around town or with Residential Properties Mr Helm

54:25

what does our Council say about [Music] um a section in our bylaws that basically

54:33

says that the town can enter anybody’s property and remove or cause to be

54:38

removed the nuisance and the owner shall be liable for any expense are they okay with that as of

54:45

right now yes so there’s always a caveat that you know

54:50

um you know people have right to privacy on that property if they put up a hard hard

54:56

no you’re not coming on my property is the town going to enter the property likely no we’ll take Court action at

55:01

that point but if there’s no resistance the town will remedy a lot of that is probably going to happen in vacant

55:07

properties if you will you know if this unoccupied property which is most of the properties that

55:12

have the issues these types of issues where they’re notified nobody responds the town goes in and takes care of the

55:18

problem and then they they basically lean the property so um I know you’ve

55:23

been working on this for a long time um sticking on that 137-5

55:30

um in the other nuisance bylaws that other towns have

55:37

um do they have this statement that the

55:42

the town can enter the property 99 of what you’re reading in front of

55:48

you is comes from another Town’s bylaw okay so is that you’re saying that that

55:53

comes from someone else it’s it exists in other bylaws I’ve never been accused

55:59

of being a Wordsmith okay well no it’s not I’m not accusing you of being a Wordsmith I’m just I I mean yes I’m not

56:05

accusing you of anything what I’m questioning is are we putting something in our bylaws that has there is no

56:14

precedent for okay and that we would be out in a frontier of governmental

56:21

intervention into people’s personal property understood and it’s and it’s it

56:27

I understand the concern that this is nothing in here is original this is coming from other communities by laws

56:34

thank you Mr Blitzer

56:40

Nick so let me ask you a question so we have a building that’s vacant

56:47

that’s an eyesore that’s a police blight on the uh

56:53

in the neighborhoods and it might be dangerous so we’re able to go in this this Bilo

57:01

will be able to get that building taken down and how does that process work

57:08

great question in an Ideal World yes so

57:13

this is where say the building code should fall short of property maintenance if you will when there’s an

57:19

unsafe situation the building coolant an unsafe structure in the building code is really only something that’s open to the

57:25

weather at grade level or really severely damaged in some fashion and it’s and it’s still open

57:32

this kind of can bring it one step further and something that you’re describing again the process doesn’t

57:38

necessarily change it’s a cease and desist that goes out to remedy that nuisance they have 10 days to remedy it

57:44

if they don’t a further notice will Pro likely go out that the town’s going to go in and take care of the problem we

57:50

have a vendor lineup we take care of the problem and we lean the property

57:55

so we put a lien on the property to get paid back that’s typically how the municipality recoups expenses in these

58:00

situations right okay so we have

58:08

even though we have the situation we have a couple of buildings that I know of that

58:15

you know I always heard well they the owner pays its taxes so we can’t do anything with that

58:21

building I’ve heard that for years so this bylaw is being created so we can

58:27

deal with buildings such as that yeah this bylaws and the intent of this

58:32

bylaw isn’t whether they pay taxes or not yeah it would still be able to make them take their building down or redo

58:39

the building yeah it’s not to give the average property owner a hard time this is these are situations where it’s it’s

58:46

well past gone people are not taking care of something they really need to take care of it it’s actually causing you know the neighborhood an actual

58:53

nuisance well I just you just want like I want Tom meaning to know that it’s a

58:59

problem we’ve had and we’ve not been able to alleviate that problem because they’re paying taxes so and I know we

59:06

had a problem in North Plymouth uh with the building that actually it’s still a hole in the ground

59:13

now and that hasn’t been remedied either so can we do something with situations like that if if it’s take buildings

59:21

taken down and it’s still an eyesore to the neighborhood is there something we can do will this by law help correct

59:27

that I think so make them improve their property okay

59:34

Mr Helm um Mr Mayo given Mr bletzer’s questions

59:40

um I’m just going to be very direct in this question in your estimation since

59:45

you’ve been working on this for quite some time and I’m sure in your mind certain properties around town have come

59:51

into mind how will this impact berts because I’m sure everybody who’s listening right now

59:58

is wondering what about birds I was wondering how long that was going to take to come up

1:00:05

this I this would have a direct impact on birds

1:00:12

how so I would imagine that that building would be ordered to the ground

1:00:19

and cleaned up their alternative is to improve the

1:00:24

property Mr brendezi did you have something to add

1:00:30

really nothing to to that last question what I wanted to add was to Mr bless’s question about paying property taxes

1:00:37

the only thing by paying your property taxes prevents the town from doing is taking your

1:00:43

property if you don’t pay your taxes the town can take your property through tax title but just because you pay your

1:00:49

property taxes that doesn’t mean that doesn’t give you the privilege or allow you to to allow your property to fall in

1:00:57

dystrapia and this bylaw is to get at those properties in which the property owners have been irresponsible and

1:01:04

they’ve allowed their properties to fall into disappear and it’s created a nuisance and a blight into that

1:01:09

neighborhood and for us would be one of a few so so if I can reiterate

1:01:17

thank you so if I can reiterate this is this bylaws it’s a long time coming we need

1:01:23

this by law sure I I don’t have to convince you

1:01:29

you’re bringing it Forward I can’t answer that one there’s no doubt this this bylaw should have taken place many

1:01:36

years ago there’s dozens and dozens of municipalities that have similar bylaws that have been remning the blights in

1:01:43

the neighborhoods primarily for what happened after the bubble the real estate Bubble Burst this these bylaws

1:01:51

are really I think became their own right after that because we were starting to see a lot of properties

1:01:57

because the mortgage the the follow-up of the mortgage crisis a lot of

1:02:02

neighborhoods and especially in City areas were falling to disrepair because of unkept properties and so you know I

1:02:08

would say we’re probably 10 years behind the eight ball on this one but here we are and we’re happy to move forward

1:02:14

just to add the which is in just as important as the funding source

1:02:20

so the ability for the town to go in and take care of these these problems is enough funding to do so

1:02:26

is important so the budget amendment that you’ll see our finance director

1:02:31

look for in the town meeting coming up with inspectional Services is the funding source directly correlated with

1:02:37

this and so Mr Mahoney

1:02:43

so I fully support this this is long overdue this is a tool that government

1:02:48

needs to um you know attack some of these issues in the community the aforementioned

1:02:55

property that Mr hell mentioned we can all mention another half a dozen but this is long overdue and I fully support

1:03:00

it uh right any other questions from any

1:03:08

members of the board Anthony does Dick have a question buddy I can’t see him because the screen’s up

1:03:14

okay if I can’t see them all look to you all right thank you um I have a question if no one else does

1:03:22

to remove a building 10 days seems ambitious is that has that been considered some of

1:03:30

the other things that are easier to fix a week and a half isn’t that bad but to safely remove for example that building

1:03:36

in North Plymouth that we’re considering removing that within 10 days notice would be uh an undertaking I would

1:03:43

imagine at least to do it safely you could probably do it in a uh the middle of the night at a very dangerous rate

1:03:50

but uh I’m assuming we don’t want to do that so our other municipalities is 10 days what

1:03:57

they’re putting for buildings how is that working out and has there been any talk about having it for some be 10 days

1:04:03

and having it for some more serious things be longer can you apply this to that yeah that’s a great question so the

1:04:09

feedback I’ve gotten from console consistently over the years with with any enforcement Authority including

1:04:14

something like this is there’s always some formal discretion and every every situation is a little different so

1:04:21

someone who has the enforcement Authority does have the discretion to either shorten or extend a timeline like

1:04:27

that in order to make it feasible to comply so remember that the goal of any

1:04:33

ordinance bylaw code is compliance so as long as you have most of the time a

1:04:40

willing party which is actually common um when when somebody gets pushed with a

1:04:45

violation they want to actually comply and sometimes a longer timeline for it

1:04:51

to become feasible is necessary and that’s always an opportunity if somebody does not want to comply

1:04:58

um I could make a few phone calls and have a building like birds down on the ground in no time it’s not that hard

1:05:06

okay that’s comforting so

1:05:14

would is there any value in having something like that in the bylaw spelled out so

1:05:20

that people are aware of what the process would be if they get one of these notices

1:05:25

well just like any other General bylaw we we can add I’m happy to add language in there if you if you feel it’s

1:05:31

necessary there’s always appeal opportunities so any of these General bylaws the appeal opportunities to the

1:05:37

court of the most competent jurisdiction in most cases it’s going to be housing court or it’ll be district court so

1:05:46

if I’m correct me if I’m wrong but I think the 10 days might be for a replay

1:05:53

they can talk to their lawyer or whatever and get back and say I’m going to do it or I’m not going to do it I I

1:06:00

think that it I think that’s what the 10 days may be for uh

1:06:06

but you know you definitely want a quick answer either you’re going to do it or you’re not going to do it and then you

1:06:11

can make arrangements so that’s what I believe but I would talk to legal counsel and see how it should be worded

1:06:19

and see how other towns do it and the reason for my question Mr Blitzer is

1:06:24

137-4 has a sentence the enforcement Authority shall declare the property of public nuisance and order the property

1:06:31

owner to remove the nuisance within 10 days after service at the notice of the violation it seems pretty quick too to

1:06:37

me but I think it may be you may want to work a little

1:06:42

differently but you definitely want to know quickly either they’re going to do it or not so I would think

1:06:50

you may be in if somebody doesn’t want to do it you may be in court they may get an objection or something I don’t

1:06:57

know so but and if I can just add I would have a legal counsel look at the other towns

1:07:03

and then then we’ll order them yep and if I can just add so the the intent here

1:07:08

is to um basically um have vendors set up for these types

1:07:14

of situations so with the town so there’s most likely a go-to contractor

1:07:20

if you will or a few of them that are available in whatever situation to remedy these issues so we’re already

1:07:26

working on that end of it so when it comes to something that needs to be demolished or cleaned up there are the

1:07:33

proper people who have the equipment they have the the means in the in the Manpower the labor to just remedy it and

1:07:39

deal with it quickly most certainly we can’t go years like we’ve been doing now so yeah we’ve got

1:07:45

to get there’s some of these buildings taken care of but anyway

1:07:52

okay uh any other questions from any other members

1:07:57

seeing none Mr bletzer would you care to make a motion I’d love to make the motion to approve Article Five so this

1:08:04

would be a motion to include Article 5 on the warrant for the October 2023 town

1:08:10

meeting anyone care to say and Mr quintal has seconded any discussion from

1:08:16

any members of the board as to whether or not Article 5 should be included on the warrant the October 2023 town

1:08:22

meeting hearing and seeing none I will call for the vote Mr bletzer I vote Yes Mr Helm

1:08:30

yes Mr Mahoney yes Mr quintal yes and myself yes

1:08:36

it is unanimous thank you Mr May that brings us into article 6 bylaw

1:08:43

Amendment striking General bylaw chapter 166 once again Nick Mayo inspectional

1:08:48

Services director so is is directed in the previous year

1:08:54

to to clean up and take a look at some old bylaws and and policies of the town this is an old

1:09:02

bylaw that was drafted back prior to the jurisdiction of the building code

1:09:09

over pools so this bylaw is quite outdated I don’t

1:09:16

know if you have the backup from Town Council for this we do okay so they

1:09:22

explain it in a little bit of a different way but this is somewhat preempted by the building code at this

1:09:27

point so the building code for safety Provisions is the authority over barriers around pools

1:09:34

so this it basically renders this pool by law moot point

1:09:41

and it’s not needed needs to be deleted just to clean up okay

1:09:48

any questions for Mr Mayo hearing

1:09:53

okay hearing and seeing none I have a motion to to include article 6 on the

1:10:00

October 23 town meeting Awards approval second Mr Mahoney has moved Mr Helm has

1:10:08

seconded that article 6 be included in the October 2023 town meeting warrant

1:10:13

any discussion from any members of the board as to whether it should be so included

1:10:19

hearing and seeing none I will call for the vote Mr bletzer yes

1:10:25

Mr Helm yes Mr Mahoney yes Mr quintal

1:10:30

yes and myself yes it is unanimous thank you again Mr Mayo

1:10:36

all right that brings us to the next article on our agenda that being article 9A an article from the community

1:10:43

preservation committee related to housing in regards to Habitat for

1:10:48

Humanity and a project with them you’re joined by Bill Cohan chair of the

1:10:53

community preservation committee bill you have the floor thank you good evening Bill Cohan with Community

1:10:59

preservation committee the committee is presenting um to fall town meeting 2023 a series of

1:11:05

recommendations starting with article 9 a on article 9A is a

1:11:14

affordable housing request of the CPA fund we the applicant came through Habitat

1:11:21

for Humanity for the uh for greater Plymouth we have worked with this organization

1:11:27

over the years at different points in time on different projects they have acquired a property they were able to

1:11:32

acquire that property uh by partnering with the town of Plymouth in the office of Community Development to to secure

1:11:40

the funding necessary to acquire the building now they’re moving to work

1:11:45

their model of uh you know pro bono work volunteerism around constructing this

1:11:52

unit the funding source that we’re that we’re

1:11:58

partnering with is a community block grant which is something the town has to apply for and then the Habitat Humanity

1:12:06

works with the office of Community Development so the committee was impressed with this partnership that was

1:12:12

put together in advance of our or consideration it is a renovation of a

1:12:18

three three bedroom single-family home so at different times you’ll see recommendations at town meeting to utilize the CPA funds for affordable

1:12:25

housing at different times it might be kind of congregate living or emergency housing Workforce housing this is really

1:12:32

about family uh one one family unit at 47 Indian ave located in Plymouth in the

1:12:40

manomet village uh kind of a 1950s Cottage

1:12:45

um and uh this is uh the property that would be renovated uh they have some

1:12:50

architectural drawings that have been provided in the package showing uh the second story structure would be added to

1:12:57

the original structure the layout of the Interior has been

1:13:05

constructed around this idea of a single family home and a first floor bedroom

1:13:10

option with two full two bedrooms up one full bedroom down which is a nice component that people

1:13:17

are looking for these days to allow that opportunity for limited Mobility

1:13:25

so the applicant is here tonight

1:13:30

the representative director Amy Bellmore I’d like to give Amy a moment

1:13:36

opportunity to talk to you about her Opera the habitat humidity and some of

1:13:42

the activities that are involved in this is a request will one hundred thousand dollars from the housing fund

1:13:49

Amy Ms Bellmore thank you thank you Bill and thank you

1:13:54

to CPC for looking at this request favorably again my name is Amy Bellmore I’m the executive director for Habitat

1:14:00

for Humanity of Greater Plymouth we have been in operation for 26 years serving

1:14:05

Plymouth and five surrounding towns this particular project would be our seventh

1:14:10

new construction project in Plymouth working to help low-income families

1:14:16

Workforce families most often the people that we serve are those who don’t have access to to traditional home financing

1:14:25

they are first-time home buyers and we serve a population of low-income

1:14:30

residents earning between 30 and 60 percent Ami and so area median income

1:14:37

and so as we look at this property as Bill described it was a unique opportunity to to take an existing

1:14:44

structure built in the 1950s it’s a small cottage and working together with our teams of volunt years both both

1:14:53

professional expertise as well as lay volunteers who who really make up our

1:14:58

labor pool habitat is able to deliver these homes to low-income families at a

1:15:05

very affordable rate it is important for people to understand that these homes are not gifted the all of these

1:15:12

homeowners do become affordable mortgage holders these this home will have a deed

1:15:18

restriction on it it will be affordable in perpetuity and they will be paying a zero

1:15:25

equivalent interest over a 30-year term so it’s an incredible opportunity for

1:15:30

those who are trying to get into their own home to have that strength and stability and self-reliance that comes

1:15:36

along with having your own home and and improvements and learning and academics and job productivity and economic growth

1:15:44

and all of the good things that come with stable housing we’re really happy to be able to provide that opportunity

1:15:50

to residents of Plymouth and surrounding towns and we’ve enjoyed a really strong relationship with the town and CPC and

1:15:58

the affordable housing trust this request is a blend of financing with

1:16:05

some coming from this hundred thousand dollar request that’s on the on this docket right now we have another just

1:16:12

over a hundred thousand dollars coming from private charitable foundations and grants and then another block of funds

1:16:21

coming from the Plymouth affordable housing trust so we’re really pleased to be able to work in Plymouth and I’m

1:16:27

happy to take your quest questions if you have any thank you Ms Bellmore any questions from the board for either

1:16:34

Mr Kohan or Ms Bellmore

1:16:39

one question Mr blutz how much is the total project going to cost

1:16:45

um we’re expecting it to be just about 289 thousand dollars and that cost could come down as we do

1:16:53

our work of leveraging our non-profit status the name recognition and trying

1:16:58

to bring in those discounted and pro bono services that will be required but in terms of the estimated cost it’s

1:17:05

about 289 290. thank you any other questions Mr Helm

1:17:13

um quick question then um piggybacking on Mr bletzer does that 289 000 include the purchase price of

1:17:22

the property it does not the Community Development block grant covered that cost and what

1:17:28

was that 259. thank you any other questions

1:17:38

all right seeing no questions uh do I have a motion I’m a member of the board

1:17:44

move approval so this would be a motion CPC articles I believe the motion would

1:17:51

be to recommend article 9A I don’t believe we can prevent CPC articles from

1:17:57

being on the warrant right um so Mr Mahoney has made a move a motion that we recommend article 9A to

1:18:05

town meeting do we have a second second it has been moved it has been seconded any discussion from members of the board

1:18:12

in regards to whether or not we should recommend article 9 a be approved by town meeting

1:18:19

hearing and seeing none I’ll call for the vote Mr bletzer how do you vote I vote yes thank you Mr Helm yes Mr

1:18:25

Mahoney yes Mr quintal yes and myself yes it is unanimous

1:18:32

so we are on to the next article thank you Ms Bill thank you very much appreciate that Mr Cohan we’re not done

1:18:39

with you yet that brings us to article 9B of the community preservation act

1:18:44

related to housing for the Plymouth Housing Authority Mr Cohan

1:18:50

thank you article 9B is a affordable housing recommendation by the community

1:18:55

preservation committee two-time meeting the applicant is the Plymouth Housing Authority we’ve worked with the Plymouth

1:19:01

Housing Authority for almost 20 years now on different projects at different times at this point this is about the

1:19:08

Oak Street School which was a operating school up until about 2010 or 11 neighborhood School

1:19:16

the building is a this project is a partnership between the town of Plymouth

1:19:22

the town of Plymouth controlled the building they turned the building over to the Plymouth Housing Authority and

1:19:28

the Plymouth Housing Authority has been moving to convert this into three affordable units in 2019 we initially

1:19:36

secured 540 thousand dollars of CPA funds for the renovation of this site

1:19:41

that was based on cost estimates done pre-covered the grant request is based

1:19:47

on a revised post covet afternoon with seen inflation we’ve seen other issues

1:19:54

come around the permitting process the permitting excuse me the bidding process so the bidding process has shown to be

1:20:02

you know a difficult thing at this point they were incurring higher cost so we

1:20:09

had to reevaluate the cost estimates that we’ve done that were done initially in the request for this application is

1:20:17

381 525 dollars that is the request

1:20:22

um and uh if I get the little advancement of my screen there’s Oak screen we all

1:20:28

know Oak Street this is a good adaptive reuse of a historical building in our village so it obviously has a

1:20:34

characteristic that goes along with the houses and the neighborhood around it uh it’s nice to see when the town partners

1:20:40

with an organization like this to find a repurposing of a public building that served as a school now to serve as

1:20:47

affordable housing in a neighborhood sometimes these buildings end up in private ownership and become expensive

1:20:53

condos that very few people can afford so we want to see what we can do with our building stock here in the town of

1:21:00

Plymouth that’s controlled by the municipality in a way that meets a major goal in our community and that’s

1:21:05

increasing the affordable units in our town we’re in a housing crisis in terms of affordability in this building here

1:21:12

is a nice example of using a building that served our community for nearly 100

1:21:17

years 130 years now serving a population when it comes to affordable housing um

1:21:24

now over the last two and a half years the Plymouth Housing Authority has been able to begin the process of renovating

1:21:33

the building they’ve already invested in the ADA Compliant ramps that are necessary in the back of the building to

1:21:39

get people safely in and out of the property they were all they were also able to alter the property there was a

1:21:44

you know kind of a dilapidated play area that had to be removed so the

1:21:51

Plymouth Housing Authority has been working with this they also partnered again with the town of Plymouth the town

1:21:56

of Plymouth saw an opportunity to help them with the water line obviously the water line servicing the building was

1:22:02

utilized for a small school a couple of bubblers Maybe few bathrooms this is going to consume

1:22:09

more water so they needed a higher water line a better water line and the town of Plymouth was able to help with that in

1:22:15

the town working with the Housing Authority adjusted the water line to the building so there’s been activities done

1:22:22

on the site that have advanced the building towards this ultimate goal of affordable units here is the current

1:22:30

[Music] um uh layout of the building pretty straightforward classroom one classroom

1:22:35

two you can see over here this is the completed ADA Compliant ramp that the Housing Authority put on last year uh

1:22:43

also over here you can see that the front door now there’ll be a hallway directly to the back through the

1:22:49

building over here there’ll be one bedroom unit a one bedroom unit this one over here is a one bedroom unit but it’s

1:22:55

a fully ADA Compliant unit so uh the community the Housing

1:23:01

Authority is constructing this unit to to address some mobility issues with a

1:23:07

growing population aging population within their demographic which needs to be addressed obviously when we build

1:23:14

units of housing like this that is specifically around in maintaining or accommodating mobility issues we keep a

1:23:21

population from having to move from Independent Living to more of nursing home living which can be more

1:23:27

problematic or having people in housing that requires more attention can be

1:23:33

burdensome to the community also so the Housing Authority is thinking out in the future in types of what type of

1:23:38

affordable housing that’s creating as Amy has indicated with the with the um

1:23:44

with habitat humidity and and what the housing authorities had to go through housing is one of the more expensive

1:23:50

attributes of the CPA to to implement because of the cost of housing and cost of land and the cost of construction uh

1:23:58

so um I have here tonight of representative from the Plymouth Housing Authority Russ

1:24:04

Shirley who’s also a member of the CPC available for any questions thank you Mr Cohen any questions from

1:24:12

members of the board I saw Mr Helm first

1:24:18

um okay so the town meeting has already

1:24:25

authorized 475 thousand dollars in CPA funds previously for this project

1:24:32

ah correct okay uh the property was given to

1:24:38

um the affordable housing the Housing Authority uh for

1:24:45

free basically correct correct okay there’s a state Grant mentioned here of

1:24:51

a hundred and fifty thousand dollars would you please explain that

1:24:57

yeah we we started out with that budget of 542 000 uh 475 came from CPA in an

1:25:06

earlier authorization we realized after not

1:25:11

being able to go forward with construction for about three years that we were short we went to the state

1:25:17

delegation and they were able to create a grant for us for 150 000 to supplement

1:25:24

the 475 we had we also came to the board of selectman and asked for some arpa

1:25:29

funds and they contributed another 22 thousand the interesting problem is that for

1:25:37

example the water main replacement which was the grant that we asked for for the Opera fund for twenty two thousand the

1:25:43

water main actually cost us 55 000. and the Ada ramp that initially we

1:25:50

thought was going to be 30 000 came in at 77 000. that’s already been built

1:25:57

um you look at the total project cost it’s a million 28 000.

1:26:04

um fifty thousand for the architect eight hundred and forty three thousand for the bids that we have already received for a

1:26:10

contractor and the items that we’ve done under site work

1:26:16

that include removing the disease trees out front cleaning up the site of playground

1:26:23

equipment including concrete foundations repaving the parking lot

1:26:28

the water main replacement which I’ve already mentioned and the Ada ramp okay so that all bundles up to as you

1:26:38

mentioned to Total spending request the the additional 381 525 when added to

1:26:48

the state Grant and the arpa brings your total request to one million twenty

1:26:53

eight thousand eight hundred and ninety six dollars correct that’s correct okay are you aware that that represents

1:26:59

343 thousand dollars per unit absolutely okay

1:27:05

um do you are you aware that a developer

1:27:10

offered 10 affordable units to this to the CPC for one hundred and twenty

1:27:18

thousand dollars per unit to make them affordable in perpetuity well this will be affordable perpetuity

1:27:25

we can’t do much more with the building than we have as far as a footprint goes

1:27:30

so I mean can you can you justify to the residents of Plymouth the taxpayers the

1:27:36

difference between 10 units at 120 per and three units at 343

1:27:43

000 per yes so the community preservation committee at different points in time

1:27:48

has gone to town meeting with recommendations to partner with private developers when they’re in the property

1:27:54

when they’re in the process of building out a complex and opportunities exist where they have the means of building

1:28:03

units quite efficiently after they achieve these permits those opportunities we have seized in in where

1:28:10

we were able to for just over a million point two uh to deed restrict nearly 23

1:28:16

units on on State Road so that was an opportunity obviously where we had an

1:28:23

economic model that was working in our favor and we often look towards developers who are working on projects

1:28:29

like that are willing to move in that direction we had a similar opportunity we would work with private developers in

1:28:34

West Plymouth where there was a complex where we had 16 units

1:28:40

that were deeded affordable through that similar program with the developers so at times developers have an opportunity

1:28:47

and when they’re presented to the town of Plymouth we take advantage of those opportunities the one in West Plymouth

1:28:52

the one in Maine Med there was one uh that was off there was an opportunity on Court Street there was an old historical

1:28:58

building but it was coupled with uh historical preservation the committee was looking at this a couple of years

1:29:05

ago I think this might be what you’re referencing and it it uh between the historical preservation in between the

1:29:11

affordable housing we were getting into an area where the level of preservation wasn’t at the same height of what we

1:29:19

were hoping to achieve and in the committee passed on that opportunity but when the committee is given an

1:29:25

opportunity to work with developers we have uh you know moved in that direction

1:29:30

uh you know on the vast majority of opportunities actually the example I

1:29:35

used is Davis Manor which is a completely new construction um Davis Manor it it’s it was whatever

1:29:44

was what was once there is no longer there and it’s being as p as people who drive by no

1:29:50

um it’s being completely rebuilt so that was the project I referenced so quite well

1:29:58

um that be a 10 affordable units were offered at a hundred and twenty thousand

1:30:04

per um and we’re paying 343 000 per for three units

1:30:11

um and I just kind of wonder about that um a question for you on the build out

1:30:16

the on the plans you have up there what are what are the square footage of each of those three units

1:30:26

we can get you an answer on the square footage

1:30:32

you have architectural plans and they don’t have the square footage we do have

1:30:37

architectural plans but uh the plans that we’ve provided for you tonight don’t show that square footage I can ask

1:30:44

the applicant to provide the additional architectural plans that that provide the square footage and I can provide

1:30:49

that at a later date right now I don’t have that available but they there are requirements by mass uh

1:30:56

dhcd to uh when you’re building an affordable unit there’s standards of square footage you have to comply by so

1:31:03

obviously uh you know the Architects that design the units had to comply to

1:31:09

those square footage requirements at dhcd so that the units can be deemed affordable they do have standards of how

1:31:16

much you can have okay thank you Mr bletzer did you have questions yes I did uh I’d like to have

1:31:22

some questions of Mr Shirley and then Bill I just have a quick question for you but Mr Shirley first

1:31:30

okay go ahead hi Mr Shirley uh when after I got elected selectman uh select

1:31:35

person excuse me I called you up and wanted to get a tour of Oak Street and

1:31:42

familiarize myself with the the house with the you know I was because I was learning and I I wanted to get up to

1:31:49

speed what’s going on in the town and we you gave me a nice tour of the place and

1:31:54

talked about what you’re going to do and I’m just wondering my problem is not

1:32:00

the price of everything but the time frame this has been I’m in my third year as a select person and I was just

1:32:07

wondering if you could explain it I’m not putting you on the spot but you what what has taken so long and the reason

1:32:12

why I’m saying it I want to talk to bill again afterwards is because the need we

1:32:18

need housing for for and I like to the disabled units uh we need senior housing

1:32:24

we need low income housing and I was wondering what has taken so long and I

1:32:30

thought there was going to be four units here when you returned well we were on about that we could have put four units

1:32:35

in but we wouldn’t have been the able to put the fully handicapped unit in uh

1:32:41

fully ADA Compliant unit in if we had gone to four units um the timing really comes a lot down to

1:32:48

delays created by covet there’s a lot of things we couldn’t go forward with during the covid environment so as far

1:32:57

as you know putting things out the bid and getting drawings done this thing was bid actually six months ago

1:33:03

but the contractors have been receptive to holding their prices

1:33:09

on this and obviously some of the work’s already been done a significant portion of the work including that handicap ramp

1:33:15

which again once again we it costs way more than we expected when I put this

1:33:21

project and budget together three years ago 475 000 seemed like adequate funding we

1:33:29

went for five for uh 542 from town meeting and it just it’s what the bids

1:33:35

came in at so um putting it out the bid would be a bigger

1:33:41

risk probably than putting it out to rebid would be a bigger risk than going forward with the

1:33:46

pricing that we’ve got if the contractors will honor it these are as I said these are four six months old bids

1:33:52

so what is your estimated completion time

1:33:58

get a release from town meeting for in October October we expect the project to

1:34:05

be completely done by March okay all right good okay and I’m all set uh

1:34:11

thank you Mr Cohen bill so Bill my my next question to you is I

1:34:18

I’ve heard we get a single family house and we get three units Apartments what

1:34:25

what’s on the horizon with CPC to try and get some affordable housing in Plymouth and specifically we need to we

1:34:33

need seniors housing for seniors and again disabled people low-income people uh

1:34:40

what what are we doing about that well if you look at the last 22 years of community preservation uh

1:34:46

recommendations to town meeting we have tried to cover all of those bases at different times from emergency housing

1:34:52

needs to congregate housing needs to senior citizens and Veterans and disabled we have brought a significant

1:34:58

number of units on we are challenged by one of the major hurdles after 22 years

1:35:04

of doing this we’ve noticed that it is the most costly component of the community preservation act to implement

1:35:11

land costs construction costs we’re always looking for opportunities to partner with different organizations to

1:35:18

to get the biggest bang for the taxpayers dollars as it as it relates to Affordable units we try to uh partner

1:35:25

with organizations like habitat or the task force for the homeless or the Housing Authority uh or the uh you know

1:35:32

the the efforts of the committee has always been that uh it’s different than

1:35:38

when you’re doing historical preservation or open space there are quite a few organizations out there that

1:35:43

are active in those Realms when it comes to affordable housing there’s only a

1:35:48

certain amount of entities out there that have the internal infrastructure in place and the systems in place to apply

1:35:55

for the money receive the money and then uh efficiently and appropriately get the project done so it is I got a limited

1:36:03

group of individuals out there that can actually get the ball over the goal line so we’re always looking for groups small

1:36:08

groups to large groups trying to cover all those bases we’re hoping in the spring of 2024 that we’ll have a

1:36:15

recommendation of significant in nature so we’re looking hopefully to have

1:36:20

something in the very near future I’m hope I’m hoping that it’s a priority and I’d like to see some more of the public

1:36:26

private uh works like we saw

1:36:31

a Market Basket and the one of many Mets uh I I at first was kind of against it

1:36:38

till I understood what it was you know it made sense to me at first I I I it

1:36:44

you know I’m saying we’re given public money to a private company but when you when you realize what you’re

1:36:50

getting in return it’s uh and they can do it a lot cheaper than we can do it so I hope we can work on that because it’s

1:36:56

a serious need in Plymouth yeah it’s a very important component of our um our implementation of CPAs not only

1:37:03

working with housing authorities and non-profits but working with private developers when they get into a position because both of those complexes were

1:37:10

very efficient and you know to Mr Helm’s concern about Court Street uh and the

1:37:15

Davis uh development uh you know sometimes you get into 55 and sometimes

1:37:21

you get into a cost that was associated with historical preservation in affordable housing that became uh

1:37:27

difficult we we hope to revisit the subject at some point about looking at

1:37:32

other projects with developers but the committee has heard the the board of selectman the committee has heard the

1:37:38

community and the committee’s been working on it for 21 years so we’re glad that everybody is focused on this and

1:37:43

and we will put the effort into it to bring more opportunities to town meeting in the near future

1:37:48

thank you Mr Mahoney yeah we Russ

1:37:56

yes sir Russ I know you cited numerous examples of cost overruns

1:38:04

I don’t know when you came in front of the board I believe I participated in that U.S for uh Opera funds

1:38:11

to the tune of 20 to 22 grand for the water line yep that’s right any how does

1:38:17

that all of a sudden you’re requesting 22 and it comes in at 55.

1:38:22

we put it out the bid we got bids from three bidders on that particular line item and

1:38:29

that’s the cost for that water main going into the building including drilling the foundation the granite

1:38:34

Foundation to get the water into the building this this the water line size is significantly bigger than the service

1:38:41

to the building now right now the service of building is only three quarters was only three quarters of an inch

1:38:47

and now this new water line service is going into four inches and it’s put in

1:38:52

there specifically so that we can sprinkle the entire building to protect it so again sprinkling a building

1:38:59

um is something a public entity has to do that a private entity

1:39:05

may not have to do um how’s the um

1:39:10

a little off topic but what’s the current wait list at the Housing Authority for you it’s a it’s a

1:39:18

it’s a Statewide wait list in its well over 20 000 people that are looking for

1:39:24

affordable housing this will be geared to this particular one the preference

1:39:29

will be given to Plymouth residents first that are ADA Compliant the cost to these

1:39:37

for rent for these places is limited to 30 percent of whatever they bring in

1:39:42

income so if they’re just getting you know a minimal income of 20 25

1:39:49

000 a year the maximum that we charge that individual is 30 percent right of their

1:39:56

income all right Russell this is uh painful we look at the preceding article

1:40:02

obviously Miss Bellmore told us that the the total cost for that um single family home down in management is

1:40:08

going to be about 550 000 for that project I can remember

1:40:14

at the height of the recession I think in 09 or 2010 Cherry Hill 2 was roughly

1:40:20

11 million in new construction 35 units so that’s still running about 315 000 a

1:40:27

unit for new construction I believe the community of Plymouth CPC

1:40:32

contributed about 2.5 to 2.6 of that halfway through that project the other

1:40:38

funding of some of the other funding collapsed and I think that project was on hold for

1:40:43

six to 12 months and um I’m going to make the assumption that the Senate President at the time

1:40:50

probably uh jumped through hoops to save the day I could be wrong in that one but we have to put this one behind us I

1:40:56

think we all agree I’m the select what there’s a need to the committee we have heard the community how do we get more

1:41:02

bang for our buck more units at a lower unit cost I would I would say that the Ada unit is bigger than we normally

1:41:09

would have per square foot for these people the two single bedroom units that

1:41:14

are on the left-hand side are more aligned with the current housing that we

1:41:19

provide and and and you can see on the left hand side we’re covering us the stairway that

1:41:26

you see on the right hand side to go down to the basement area we have have to cover that over to

1:41:32

create the living space for that uh left hand bottom unit and then the right hand

1:41:38

unit as you can see we’re also providing uh wash washing machines dryers and you

1:41:45

know storage space for the people that live in these properties

1:41:52

thank you any other questions from the board Mr helm uh just to follow up on on something

1:41:59

that was stated well Mr bletzer was asking questions

1:42:04

um Mr Shirley you mentioned that the bids

1:42:10

are six the current bids that we’re working on with this one million 28

1:42:15

896 and your additional request for 381 525 or six months out of date and you

1:42:24

haven’t gone back to them to see if they would honor these so that’s still up in the air no no I

1:42:31

actually stated that we’ve gone back to the contractors that place the bids and they say they will honor the bids for

1:42:38

the construction which is 843 700. that added to the architectural cost and

1:42:45

the completed projects which I described above of 135 that’s where the total comes out

1:42:51

to one million 028 96. okay I I I was mistaken in what I

1:42:59

heard thank you all right thank you any other questions from members of the board

1:43:05

if no one else does I do Mr Kohan my questions are for you

1:43:11

uh Bill the if I’m reading this correctly although the initial authorization was for 475 000 uh to date

1:43:20

expenditures have been 135 196 dollars is that correct

1:43:26

um yes I would have to agree that that is the current balance okay

1:43:33

uh so you you mentioned earlier

1:43:39

um that you try you’ve heard the board in relation to trying to get bang more

1:43:45

bang for your bucket of some of these units um are you aware that in 2019 the

1:43:54

average value of a single family home in Plymouth was 389 thousand dollars

1:44:02

that’s approximately yes around before the pandemic obviously the numbers have gone up since then but right but this

1:44:08

was an article that originally came before town meeting in October of 2019. yep right so at that time the average

1:44:15

value of a single family home according to real estate sales in that year was 389 thousand dollars this is for three

1:44:23

single bedroom units correct correct uh and

1:44:31

when we last as a board opined as to the

1:44:37

production of affordable housing in the recent past by

1:44:42

the CPC we went through and over the past eight

1:44:48

years I know you’ve been doing it for 21 but over the past eight let’s focus on

1:44:53

that you’ve added 48 units including these three you’ve had six articles related to

1:45:01

affordable housing and that’s out of 79 total articles that the CPC has produced

1:45:08

um so are you I guess I I’m I understand as

1:45:14

you said that the affordable housing is more expensive per article by Nature

1:45:21

because you’re of what you’re doing there building housing versus buying open space or something of that nature

1:45:27

um but can you explain these numbers 48 units in eight years including these

1:45:32

three only six articles in eight years out of 79 articles

1:45:38

as I indicated before the committee has found over the 21 years that it’s that

1:45:44

it’s implemented this which far exceeds the 48 units brought online is that the cost that is incurred that

1:45:51

getting units uh so it’s an expensive uh effort to build units uh and to put them

1:45:58

online and again as I mentioned before there’s a limited number of possible

1:46:04

applicants we are a granting body we give out grants so people have to apply we do what we can to promote

1:46:12

interest in the in the fund by releasing a new application every every year by

1:46:18

reaching out to the Housing Community letting them know that there is an application that they could pull and we

1:46:24

wait to hear from them we reach out to developers so we are doing the Outreach to let people know there’s an

1:46:30

application cycle and they should file but we are granting body we do our best to draw our attention to this fund to

1:46:37

the different parties that might be able to bring a project to fruition and like I said before there’s only a limited

1:46:44

pool of entities out there that have the ability to take such funds properly put

1:46:51

it out to bid and then get that project completed when it comes to affordable housing you know we’ve noticed in the

1:46:57

house in the open space Community there’s numerous open space organizations in open space and opportunities and the same with

1:47:04

historical preservation but for historical uh that is for open space

1:47:10

it’s a it’s a little bit more daunting we’re required by 10 percent and we put

1:47:15

that money aside and like I said before we’re hoping to come to Springtown meeting with a project of significance

1:47:22

and we do the best we can based on the applicants that we receive and if there

1:47:30

is an entity over the last 21 years that has brought on affordable housing or is worked with number of units excuse me

1:47:37

number of organizations it has been Community preservation act in the town of Plymouth that has that has been at

1:47:43

the Forefront to Bringing more affordable units online so we like I said before you know we look forward to

1:47:50

the challenges in the future there’s opportunities and we’ve heard the board and we’ve heard the community and we’ve

1:47:56

been working on this for many years and again we hope to bring additional recommendations to Springtown meeting

1:48:02

but Mr Helm alluded to a project a recent project where the cause per unit would be 120 000 for 10 units and this

1:48:10

is 343 000 all toll between this and the October of 2019 article for three units

1:48:17

so to me that doesn’t sound like you’re getting that much bang for your buck there yeah well I I guess in in certain

1:48:25

circumstances we have found opportunities with different applicants uh a level of efficiency that has

1:48:31

brought us back to the table that developer that you reference we worked again with that development an

1:48:37

opportunity arise and we look forward to working for working with any other developer that brings forward an

1:48:43

opportunity like that but you have to look at things differently from a Housing Authority that has a whole

1:48:48

multitude of responsibilities in terms of construction maintenance and qualifications they’re uh they’re an

1:48:54

entity that’s bringing quite a bit of services throughout the community and then you have to look at a developer who

1:49:01

has achieved permits through the inclusionary zoning bylaws and different other permitting processes so there in a

1:49:08

different situation than the Housing Authority so in some ways the Housing Authority can do things efficiently in

1:49:15

in the developer can do things efficiently and the effort into the committee is to look at those applicants

1:49:20

and understand the importance of this question and get the question before town meeting and have town meeting make

1:49:28

their recommendation accept or decline the recommendation so as I said before our effort is

1:49:35

focused on those activities of bringing in opportunities

1:49:40

okay any other questions by any members of the board hearing and seeing none do I have a

1:49:48

motion to recommend tell meeting approve article 9 B motions are always made in

1:49:54

the affirmative Ruble Mr Mahoney has moved

1:49:59

second Mr bletzer has seconded has been moved it has been seconded any

1:50:05

discussion from any members of the board as to whether or not we should recommend town meeting approve article 9B dealing

1:50:11

with affordable housing in the Oak Street School Mr helm I just feel the need to reiterate

1:50:17

343 thousand dollars per unit you can see up there two of those units are not

1:50:24

very large um the comparison to the cost of the house on Indian Street that’s a three

1:50:31

bedroom two bath home okay which at market rate would probably go just about

1:50:37

the total cost of this so they’re building a considerably larger home it’s a family home these are small and a 343

1:50:47

thousand dollars per I think it’s exorbitant um I yes the import affordable housing

1:50:53

is is unbelievably important to the future of Plymouth I mean we have employers who

1:50:59

can’t find people to work in their in their places of employment because people can’t find housing we’ve all seen

1:51:07

what’s going on out on Cape Cod in that manner and it’s only going to come here I mean it’s already starting here and

1:51:13

it’s going to come here so affordable housing is important but there also has to be a sensibility about it and I just

1:51:21

think this is a project that is out of control at this point um it’s it’s nice that I’m glad that the

1:51:28

the bidder from West Bridgewater is going to honor that honor that bid but

1:51:35

um we don’t know that it won’t cost more than one million 28 29 000 when all is

1:51:42

said and done when they get in to start starting the construction um I I just think that yes affordable

1:51:50

housing is incredibly important but I think that it needs to be also a certain

1:51:57

sensibility of about it and I’m not saying market rate or anything I understand that it will be more

1:52:03

expensive but once again 343 thousand dollars per unit when we had a developer

1:52:09

who has worked with the CPA before or the CPC before offer 10 units as opposed

1:52:16

to three each one for one hundred and twenty thousand um I think in a way this is starting to

1:52:24

resemble to me in my my years here um as the Science House Revisited I mean

1:52:31

different purposes I mean this one is fully affordable housing Sim’s house was sort of a layer cake of of issues with

1:52:40

you know uh historic preservation affordable housing open space etc etc

1:52:46

um this is a little bit more uh focused but once again I Just Can’t Help

1:52:52

Believing and seeing that we are going down the symes house road again and I

1:52:59

just cannot support this uh we are into this project for

1:53:05

135 197 dollars that includes the one dollar

1:53:10

that the affordable housing paid for this unit the assessed value is 471 thousand

1:53:18

dollars I say sell it um and turn it into a tax paying entity

1:53:25

and just um figure out other ways more efficient

1:53:30

um larger volume ways to get these these single person

1:53:35

um affordable units Mr bletzer I guess excuse me I just want to see

1:53:42

this project finished like I said it’s a long time coming uh three years ago I

1:53:48

saw it and and Mr Shirley told me all about it but at this point if we wait

1:53:54

any longer the price keeps going up so at this point we’re too far into it we need housing low-income

1:54:02

disabled housing senior housing so it’s I know it’s only three units but let’s

1:54:07

get this done okay I want to get it done before the price goes up even further thank you

1:54:14

any other discussion from any other members Mr Helm I just need to reiterate what we

1:54:23

are into this project for on this date in time is 135

1:54:29

197 dollars that’s what we’re into this project for yes money has CPA has

1:54:35

already authorized 475 000. if it doesn’t get spent it doesn’t get spent okay we are into this project a number

1:54:43

of years yes but only 135 197 dollars

1:54:50

thank you Mr Helm any other discussion from other members of the board nobody else does then I do

1:54:57

so uh we the issue of affordable housing is very important as the presenter said we

1:55:04

are in an affordable housing crisis and I don’t think this appropriately addresses uh the issue

1:55:10

as to this refrain that the CPC is a granting Authority and only takes in the

1:55:17

applications that they receive I mean we’re sitting in a building that I know was uh sought out by the CPC or at least

1:55:25

by members of the CPC we have another item on our agenda in article 9g we took a tour of Hedges Pond

1:55:33

over the winter and there was interest at that time by the CPC to preserve The

1:55:41

Sheds there from the 1940s they were used as dormic Isles at that time for

1:55:47

overnight campers so they were looking actively to seek out preservation there

1:55:52

obviously they’ve shifted gears here and are now looking to demolish those which I think is a better use of that because

1:55:57

they’re lined with lead but I’ll wait till article 9g to get into that in more depth

1:56:03

but I think personally this is a four-year-old project now because it

1:56:09

came first in October of 2019 and now we’re in October of 2023 and it’s three

1:56:15

single bedroom units whereas in 2019 a single family house not a one bedroom

1:56:21

unit but a single family house was 389 thousand dollars and if the CPC isn’t

1:56:28

looking for houses that they could buy to make a better use of that money then

1:56:33

the affordable housing trusts exist there are developers they’re looking for deed restrictions there are other avenues that they could spend it this

1:56:41

simply put is a historical preservation project masquerading as an affordable

1:56:46

housing project this is about preserving the Oak Street School much more than it is about

1:56:53

providing affordable housing in this community 343 thousand dollars per unit

1:56:58

for single bedroom units those are the types of units that an individual can

1:57:03

live in for in a sustained period but a couple would be cramped in and probably

1:57:08

would not want to stay in for any period of time and a family if you have once you have a kid you might be able to

1:57:15

squeeze in there for a little bit while your kid’s in a crib but beyond that you’re gonna need to move out so it’s

1:57:21

not really sustainable housing for a lot of people in this community in the way that a single family home would be would

1:57:28

also add that in 2019 a three family home the average cost was 422 thousand

1:57:34

dollars so if in 2019 instead of seeking out this preservation project and

1:57:41

masquerading and is an affordable housing project uh we could have had at least two single-family homes or three

1:57:50

family homes if we were willing to put a one million 28 896 total dollars into

1:57:56

that project and that those houses could have been occupied over the intervening four years as opposed to just sitting

1:58:04

here waiting for somebody to complete it I am in complete agreement with Mr Helm I don’t want to participate in this sunk

1:58:11

cost fallacy that because we’ve already spent 135 197 because we’ve already

1:58:16

appropriated 475 that were obligated to throw in another 381. I I this very much

1:58:24

reminds me of the symes house which is an ongoing problem another issue there where that was primarily for historic

1:58:31

and open space and we crammed some affordable housing in it to make the dollar figures work this this is not an

1:58:37

appropriate use of affordable housing funding in this community you’re not you say you want to get bang for your buck

1:58:42

you’re not getting bang for your buck here this is very much not what we need you over the last eight years 48 units

1:58:50

six articles and you uh and that includes this as one of those article one of those units and one of those

1:58:57

articles so the production there is just not forthcoming and if we’re in an

1:59:02

affordable housing crisis and this is how we’re addressing it we’re never going to get out of that crisis and we’re never going to be providing needed

1:59:09

units to people in this community that are desperate to have this type of housing so they can start building a

1:59:15

life in and around this community and they are just as valuable a member of this community as people with

1:59:21

multi-million dollar homes and they have a place here and they’re not being provided in my opinion we have limited

1:59:27

oversight of the CPC we can recommend or not recommend these to town meeting we appoint a few people uh to the CPC we

1:59:35

have our liaison Mr Mahoney to my right who serves on the CPC but we have to

1:59:40

take what influence we can here and I’m not going to sign off on the sunk cost fallacy or this affordable housing

1:59:46

project that isn’t really affordable housing and it’s really historical preservation for so for those reasons I

1:59:53

intend to vote against this any other discussion from any other members of the board

1:59:58

hearing and seeing none I will call for the vote once again alphabetically through the role yes no or abstain when

2:00:04

I reach your name Mr bletzer how do you vote I vote yes thank you thank you Mr Helm no

2:00:10

Mr Mahoney yes Mr quintal yeah

2:00:15

and myself no sort of vote of three of two rather to three the motion does not

2:00:22

carry we will not recommend article 9C 9B to town meeting that brings us to

2:00:28

article 9 C once again Mr Cohan article 9C is a recommended by the

2:00:34

recommendation by the community preservation committee for the restoration Rehabilitation and preservation of the 1899 Russell Library

2:00:44

on 11 at 11 North Street this is a historical preservation recommendation

2:00:49

it is uh on top of a 2007 acquisition of

2:00:55

997 thousand dollars the CPA fund was utilized in 2007 to acquire the building

2:01:01

the Russell libel the Russell Library the lindens building and the property

2:01:06

there uh where the the land that the buildings sit on that was purchased in 2007 since then over the last uh over

2:01:15

the last 17 years the Plymouth act Guild

2:01:21

has owned the building they have a hundred year lease with an option for an additional 100 years they’ve raised over

2:01:26

3 million dollars during their ownership of the building and they reinvested it in the building the building is the land

2:01:32

is owned by the town the building is controlled by the the yacht Guild for the next 100 years

2:01:38

with a hundred year option to lease it again but they are investing in a in a

2:01:44

town asset and not only are they investing in the town asset but they are

2:01:50

providing Services there’s classes that are taking place at the Art Guild educational art classes that can be

2:01:58

taken there’s events in forums and functions all of these activities bring activity to our downtown

2:02:05

fostering and kind of a cultural Renaissance where we have people using

2:02:10

our restaurants using our local hotels visiting downtown Town Plymouth spending

2:02:16

more time and spending more money they’re not just coming for a short stay they’re spending more time coupling

2:02:22

their activities around the Center for the Arts with other businesses in downtown Plymouth the request is for 243

2:02:31

to all the 243 942 dollars this is for significant facade work and roof work

2:02:37

around the complex mostly focusing on the Russell building um

2:02:43

and if you look over here you’ll see this is uh LeBaron alley it’s an alley

2:02:50

it’s actually a public way that stretches from Middle Street to North Street we are looking at this building

2:02:57

you can see the facade of this building is uh you know significant architectural

2:03:03

features of a Roman estile building in brick that is being that is seeing some

2:03:08

deterioration so this brick building needs to be repointed this is very similar work that we did on this

2:03:14

building on the exterior of the 1820 Courthouse after a period of time you have to get at that line motor mix and

2:03:20

you have to repoint it or you can have water infiltration freezing thawing cracking of bricks the facade can be

2:03:28

compromised it’s a similar project that we worked on in town square with the National Memorial Meeting House the

2:03:33

facade of that building you can see where they have after a hundred years you’re starting to see the deterioration

2:03:40

that we need to address

2:03:46

the little clickers clicking or

2:03:52

might have to go manual I’m not sure if that’s oh there it is

2:03:57

so uh this is a nice uh example of uh some of the repairs that had been made

2:04:03

uh in the past they weren’t using the appropriate lime motor mix more of a

2:04:09

Portland mix which doesn’t allow moisture to pass through it and you have freezing and cracking so we need to get

2:04:14

out where the mistakes were made and correct that with a more historically accurate line motor that responds to the

2:04:20

weather around here more efficiently and we’ll get a longer lasting facade and less damage that you’re seeing here on

2:04:27

this wall that comes out from the building again this is the back of the building

2:04:32

you can see here in the back of the building the facade of this building had

2:04:38

an alteration back in the 1940s there was an alteration to the lower level of

2:04:43

this area to allow for a children’s section of the library they brought in some i-beams and they temporary they

2:04:49

they made alterations to the building digging away the foundation exposing areas to let light into the lower level

2:04:55

this did compromise the building that would require some attention so it’s not only the brickery pointing but dealing

2:05:02

with some of these issues around some of the windows got his roof

2:05:08

here is an example of where that situation developed so we’re looking at

2:05:15

repairing that here’s another example of some of the

2:05:20

areas that had been exposed to allow more light into the lower left of the building are going to need

2:05:26

addressing some structural issues this is the interior of the building

2:05:31

there’s a skylight that allows light into the Russell reading room which is now a an art gallery in a performance

2:05:38

center for events uh their plan is to keep the Skylight but

2:05:45

obviously they’re going to have to address some of the the windows and copper flashing around the building so

2:05:51

this recommendation of 443 942 has uh

2:05:56

also recommendations on repairing this section of the building the roof was

2:06:01

replaced about 12 years ago so the roof is is fine it’s the flashing and the

2:06:08

copper and the and the skylights that need to be addressed after a hundred years there needs to be some attention

2:06:14

paid to these materials uh and this is the section of the building that they’d be working on

2:06:22

uh also working on the doors of the buildings some lead line glass windows

2:06:28

if you haven’t been in the Russell Library it is a a nice functional space uh where many events take place here in

2:06:35

the town of Plymouth the building is uh currently we have an agreement with the

2:06:41

Plymouth center for the Yachts that events that the town can request the use

2:06:48

of this building free of charge based on availability and they also allow events

2:06:54

that they sponsor a free two students in the town of Plymouth based on availability of those tickets that might

2:07:03

be available for performance or opening that is being run by the center for the for the Yachts not if those those

2:07:11

agreements don’t exist if there’s a private entity renting the building and using the building it’s only for events

2:07:18

sponsored by the Center for the Arts I have here tonight Eileen pachico with the Center for the Arts she can give you

2:07:25

just a quick update on some of the things that they’re working on as it relates to this project

2:07:36

there am I mean Pacheco I’m a volunteer at Plymouth Center for the Arts and I’m a member of the board of directors for

2:07:42

the Plymouth Guild which is the non-profit which runs the Plymouth Arts Center thank you Bill and I think the

2:07:50

CPC for recommending our project um we’ve been in this building since 2007

2:07:57

we opened the art center in 2008 after making some initial Renovations but the

2:08:03

Plymouth Guild has actually been a fixture in Plymouth for over 50 years a

2:08:09

group of local artists started the first outdoor archo in Plymouth in 1968 and the

2:08:17

Plymouth Guild nonprofit was founded in 1973. so our our folks have been busy in

2:08:24

the town bringing Arts bringing the Arts to Plymouth since then um

2:08:30

since we’ve been in in this location as Bill mentioned we’ve raised and reinvested about three million dollars

2:08:37

into the property recently uh completing a 1.7 million dollar

2:08:43

accessibility project that installed an elevator and we did have some additional

2:08:49

funds from CPA for that but we raised a lot of funds from other sources including the state

2:08:56

Mass cultural Council the mass office of traveling tourism and many local

2:09:01

businesses and individual donors who support us we run a full portfolio of programs

2:09:09

including education we we put on about 175 classes and

2:09:15

workshops last year including classes for folks with disabilities for children

2:09:21

we have [Music] Let’s see we have Let’s see we have uh an artisan shop

2:09:28

which showcases the Wares of 80 plus local

2:09:34

Artisans uh their their products are for sale there we host uh approximately 12

2:09:40

shows a year so there’s always something new up on the wall that showcases our

2:09:46

local artists and it also brings folks to Plymouth to the downtown area they

2:09:51

come to the art center and then they go to dinner they go for a drink

2:09:56

and let’s see I don’t know there’s so many things that we do Kathy um

2:10:03

yes and and openings

2:10:13

and uh where where primarily volunteer run

2:10:18

um uh we’re we’re we have a volunteer board and and a whole host of volunteers I think there’s about 80 active

2:10:24

volunteers that help us keep us open to the public 52 weeks a year so

2:10:29

thank you um and as as Arlene indicated uh and

2:10:35

Kathy’s indicated in everyone’s work towards this is a major form of economic development of our downtown uh we’ve

2:10:41

seen over the last 20 years a strengthening of economic conditions there and this is just a component of it

2:10:47

in terms of the Arts and entertainment and culture that draws people from the region it’s a major form of Economic

2:10:53

Development having these attributes in our town so we’ve worked with the Art Guild over the years and we’re happy to

2:10:59

make this recommendation to fall Town Meeting thank you thank you any questions from members of

2:11:06

the board Mr Helm

2:11:11

[Music] okay in in no particular order

2:11:16

um I see that this is part of a 20-year plan could you give us a briefing on that

2:11:24

20-year plan that looks quite involved yes 20-year systems

2:11:30

running effort funded by a grant from partially by a grant from the mass cultural Council we

2:11:37

also matched the cost of that Grant in which MCC paired us with

2:11:43

a non-profit financing consultancy and

2:11:48

an engineering firm they came through the building looked at everything the

2:11:53

entire envelope of the building all of our systems and mapped out the age and

2:11:59

expected life life expectancy of all those elements of the building

2:12:04

and mapped out a 20-year plan on when we would need to start to replace things or repair them along with estimated costs

2:12:12

and the 20-year plan also serves as a financial roadmap for

2:12:19

us so that we’re putting ourselves on this path to self-sufficiency and self-funding of

2:12:26

future Our intention is to be able to self-fund Future preservation projects

2:12:31

as we we work to raise and save the funds necessary for the next couple of

2:12:38

decades and Beyond well congratulations on on going forward with

2:12:46

a 20-year strategic plan I think that’s very wise and a number of institutions

2:12:51

in this town should probably take a lesson from you but I do see that the

2:12:56

total that was figured was one million three hundred and fifteen thousand and

2:13:01

this represents a total of although your request is 443 the total involved in

2:13:08

this tranche is six hundred and thirty one

2:13:14

thousand um what is your plan for the remaining

2:13:20

seven hundred thousand dollar um seven hundred thousand dollars so the elements of this proposal were for items that

2:13:28

were deemed requiring um immediate attention within the next three to five years

2:13:35

and so our strategic this systems plan for 20 years is also a financial plan

2:13:42

for us so we’re going to be funding developing a fund that puts us

2:13:48

in position to fund those other Renovations they’re not all preservation

2:13:53

but you know all the systems work that will need to be done over the 20 years so I see that you know with the 443 from

2:14:03

from the CPC there’s also 190 for this first uh the first three to five years

2:14:11

um are how are you going to fund that so we are applying for other

2:14:16

grants we already we just received one from the mass office of travel and tourism through 25 000 will be

2:14:23

submitting an application with MCC again their their window doesn’t open until

2:14:28

November and we will be doing a capital uh fundraising effort

2:14:33

um among our supporters but you do feel confident in the three to five year time since these are the most important

2:14:39

things that you will be able to achieve that one hundred and ninety thousand dollars through grants and fundraising

2:14:45

yes we were successful with our Elevate the Arts fundraising project for the

2:14:52

accessibility renovation we raised 1.7 million just for that and we’ve raised

2:14:58

funds for a number of other improvements at the property since we took residents

2:15:04

there in 2008. okay um one last thing I noticed on the summary and intent that’s included

2:15:11

that you have mentioned also subject to free admission

2:15:17

to the residents of Plymouth through January 2025 what would that be in

2:15:23

reference to I thought that would that be shows that costs have emissions

2:15:29

missions because I’m a little confused right now this is in reference to free admission

2:15:36

to the residents and students of Plymouth free Mission through 2025 but

2:15:42

right now students are free based on availability students are free

2:15:50

to attend um center for the art sponsored events

2:15:55

but right now through this agreement on this free admission I thought it was

2:16:01

mentioned that admission is free free mission is

2:16:06

free for the gallery coming in and going to the store and going to the gallery but for events that are sponsored by the

2:16:13

arcgill there are some that they do charge and there’s some that they don’t uh this would be that the the

2:16:20

programming that would be free to the residents in the different uh forums like the Ocho the annual art show is

2:16:26

free to the residents of Plymouth okay but but it people who not residents are charged admission to the art show

2:16:33

um no no it’s free to everyone okay all right yeah the art center is

2:16:40

free and open to the public except for um some paid events certain receptions

2:16:47

or entertainment um that may be ticketed events and

2:16:52

um I think those may be the events that builds uh notice here it’s referring to I would need to look up you know I don’t

2:17:00

this is kind of before my time so I’d have to investigate this I would expect this would be something we’d want to

2:17:06

carry forward but I don’t well yeah I mean in that and and hence my question

2:17:11

um when I look at January 2025 it seems like it’s way in the future but soon

2:17:18

enough we’re going to turn around and it’s going to be January of 2024. so so in this this summary intent you’re

2:17:25

offering the residents of Plymouth who are helping fund this um one year of free admission to these

2:17:33

special events or whatever requires admission um and yet this funding that we’re

2:17:40

participating in the six you know the 443 that’s part of the 690

2:17:45

um is going to go on for five years and I just would I question why it would

2:17:55

only be through one year and why it isn’t longer for the residents of Plymouth who are helping fund this

2:18:02

um and I guess there I don’t know what’s in the actual

2:18:09

um I can um it isn’t mentioned in the

2:18:14

actual article um but I Rec I would recommend that you

2:18:20

take a look at that because one year which is effectively what we’re talking about we’ll revisit this agreement that

2:18:26

we had from the original article and other articles and to see where they want to establish that date and time too

2:18:32

so we’ll revisit that and get a clarification to the to the board exactly what they’re going to offer uh

2:18:38

and would they be willing to go beyond 2025 okay

2:18:46

any other questions from any members of the board

2:18:52

so uh if no one else does

2:19:00

I see there’s a notation that in addition to what Mr Helm just circled in

2:19:06

on the agreement will be contingent upon an agreement to allow access for special 10 of Plymouth use of the building free

2:19:13

I I have attended CPC meetings at the Center for the Arts was the CPC paying

2:19:19

for no so this is from the original agreement from 2007 when we acquired the

2:19:24

building for 970 and we filed the lease with the lease that was established around the property there was this under

2:19:31

agreement that the town of Plymouth would have use of the building for

2:19:36

meetings there for Town sanctioned committees so the CPC is not charged to

2:19:43

use the building when they have their meetings this is just extending that existing well not extending it’s just

2:19:48

keeping in place the existing agreement correct to reiterate it’s uh reaffirming

2:19:54

that understanding that the town of Plymouth can utilize the building based on

2:20:00

availability free of charge for Town sanctioned committee it says here that

2:20:06

such a request would require will require a request from the board of Selectmen so the select board make a request for

2:20:15

you to be able to meet them well we we include the select board in that in that process so that uh there’s uh former

2:20:22

Channel formal channels of request so um you know we thought it would be

2:20:27

helpful to include that language so the board would would know what meetings are taking place there and the town would

2:20:33

know what meetings are taking place there um is that in the existing language uh no that’s not existing we thought that

2:20:40

it would be helpful so that there was some formality to that process that the

2:20:48

Art Guild could the select board could request to

2:20:53

utilize the site so so in the future if you wanted to meet there you would have to request that meeting space through

2:21:00

the select board is what you’re saying um the language of the article in the

2:21:07

summary does reflect that intention that it is okay

2:21:12

I have no other questions any other uh questions from any other members of the board

2:21:18

hearing and seeing none do I have a motion to recommend town meeting approve

2:21:24

article 9C I’ll make the motion Mr bletzer has moved else second Mr Helm

2:21:29

has seconded it has been moved it has been seconded any discussion from any members of the board

2:21:35

yes Mr Blitzer uh I’ve been to the

2:21:41

yeah it’s uh several times I’ve been to political caucuses there I’ve been to

2:21:46

events there and I can just tell you I don’t care if it’s one year free five

2:21:52

years free it doesn’t matter that that building is exactly what we should be using CPA money for it’s a historic

2:21:59

building we need to preserve it and we need the ads in Plymouth we need the ads

2:22:06

are good for our tourism they’re good for our kids they’re good for our culture our seniors

2:22:12

it’s very important when I was on the pgdc I’ll tell you how important it was when we were designated Lots we left

2:22:20

that light right down there is a limited light just for the folks at the ATS the Plymouth of the Arts because there were

2:22:27

so many volunteers there and we wanted to make sure they had somewhere to park because they were volunteer in their

2:22:33

time so it’s very important just like the Spire Center just like the Hedge

2:22:38

house just like the museum Pilgrim Museum these are all important uh

2:22:44

buildings for our tourism and it’s exactly what we should be using CPA money for us so I’m going to vote in

2:22:50

favor of this thank you thank you Mr Blitzer Mr helm I’m going to vote in

2:22:55

favor as well for all of the reasons that Mr bletzer mentioned

2:23:01

um but I will with that vote encourage you to examine

2:23:08

that one year okay doesn’t seem that that’s long

2:23:13

enough for the residents you know for the residents of Plymouth given that it

2:23:18

is their tax money okay it’s important that we remember that the CPC money is

2:23:25

derived from the taxpayers of Plymouth it is matched to a certain extent by the state but the taxpayers of Plymouth do

2:23:32

fund it so I just encourage you to take a look at that and see if you can extend

2:23:37

it thank you Mr Helm any other discussion

2:23:43

if there’s none I would add that I agree with Mr Helm that that one year should be Revisited I get that it’s a sweetener

2:23:49

it’s not the primary we’re not paying 631 000 just for a year of free attendance because it’d have to be some

2:23:55

swinging events for that to be worth it but um it it’s not it’s only a little bit of sweetener it could be a little bit

2:24:01

better given the amount of money I get that there’s a big public uh benefit to having this there it’s just something to

2:24:07

think about all right any other discussion hearing and seeing none I will call for

2:24:13

the vote Mr bletzer how do you vote I vote yes thank you Mr Helm yes Mr

2:24:19

Mahoney yes Mr quintal yes and myself yes it is unanimous we

2:24:25

will recommend the town meeting approve article 9C it brings us to the next item on our agenda that being article 9d the

2:24:32

community preservation acts uh article related to a pilgrim Hall project Mr

2:24:40

Cohen thank you article 9 9d is a community preservation committee

2:24:48

recommendation a full-time meeting for historical preservation of the pilgrim Hall Museum here in downtown Plymouth so

2:24:57

under article 9 the applicant is Pilgrim Hall Museum the request is for 3.2 million dollars this is really about

2:25:04

protecting the largest collection of archives and manuscripts and documents and photographs and historical

2:25:12

artifacts covering over 400 years here in Plymouth so it’s important to note

2:25:17

that here in downtown Plymouth we have one of the oldest museums in North America that houses this collection that

2:25:25

not only depicts the events of the last 400 years but in recent years has made

2:25:30

great strides to go beyond that including the indigenous people as part of their story here in Plymouth so the

2:25:40

pill the pilgrim home museum has been evolving over time obviously formed in 1820 it’s now

2:25:47

2023. obviously they have maintained these archives they’ve collected these

2:25:53

archives they’ve Advanced with time this Museum obviously is a draw to our

2:25:59

community in terms of Economic Development you have to understand in many ways Pilgrim Hall Museum has been a

2:26:06

very close partner with the town of Plymouth it is Pilgrim Hall that gifted

2:26:12

Parkland to the town of Plymouth the forefather monument that was donated

2:26:18

and it was under prop it was an asset owned by the pilgrim Hall Museum that

2:26:24

was donating donated to the Commonwealth of Massachusetts that land in that Monument there’s other examples of other

2:26:30

land that they were able to Grant to the town so for many for centuries the

2:26:36

pilgrim Hall Museum has been a partner with the community not only housing this collection but by finding opportunities

2:26:42

outside of their Museum to tell the story of of the last 400 years and

2:26:50

Beyond this uh project is specifically around

2:26:55

addressing uh the roof in the Skylight uh of the building there were alterations to the original building to

2:27:02

let in light there were further alterations to the building uh to accommodate that over a period of time

2:27:09

the leaking has become pretty intense around this and threatening the

2:27:14

building’s functionality in terms of its Archives this is also about replacing the light the skylight with more natural

2:27:21

with with um with a lighting system that better displays the the artifacts in the museum

2:27:29

obviously the functionality of the museum and displaying of its autoclave artifacts will attract more attention to

2:27:36

the museum and more visitors this is a important part of the functionality of museums it needs to be an experience

2:27:42

when you go to it not only the museum itself but the artifacts that are stored in the collection

2:27:47

um there is another component of this during the renovations of the Great Hall in Pilgrim Hall there’ll be a collection

2:27:55

of very specific artifacts that will have to be removed from the building to

2:28:00

do the work so it’s important to note that this project over a period of time

2:28:06

is going to you know address these issues the building has been facing in

2:28:13

recent years about the infiltration of water and the water damage to the building I’d like to introduce the

2:28:18

director of Pilgrim Hall Museum Donna Curtin she can walk you through these upcoming slides to show the scope of

2:28:24

work and she also has a Lynn Spencer with Spencer Sullivan Vogel preservation

2:28:31

firm that’s been working with Pilgrim Hall and in looking at the scope of work

2:28:37

and and what it will entail and what it will cost Donna

2:28:43

thanks Bill thank you so much for the opportunity to the select board members Mr quintil Mr

2:28:51

Canty for the opportunity to speak to you tonight David Peck and Lynn Spencer Spencer preservation group are going to

2:28:57

follow me I’ll try to be quick I know it’s late in the night but there are a couple things about our Museum that I hope everybody understands as we bring

2:29:04

this very significant request to you not only is Pilgrim Hall Museum a landmark of Plymouth history

2:29:10

for our town and our region and beyond that scope the building itself is one of

2:29:16

the oldest purpose built public buildings in Plymouth and it has the distinction of being the oldest

2:29:22

continuously operating Public Museum in the entire United States it’s listed on the state and National register there

2:29:28

are no less than three deeded historic restrictions on the property and that means there are certain things we can and we can’t do with this building but

2:29:35

one of the things that I think it’s really important for everyone to know is that we have actually inside that

2:29:40

building have some of the valuable collections that bill was referring to including in the 17th century

2:29:46

possessions of the Mayflower pilgrims who established Plymouth Colony here and even older artifacts of the indigenous

2:29:53

Wampanoag people of the region many works of unique art that reflect the

2:29:59

history of our place archival materials of national significance from many different eras we are the stewards of

2:30:07

the history of our town and we have been doing this for over 200 years the museum

2:30:14

building itself is 199 years we just celebrated our birthday last Friday

2:30:20

and this unique and irreplaceable collection is really wild why we’re here before you we cannot do the work that we

2:30:27

need to do with stewards without a tight building envelope without protection

2:30:33

from a roof in a skylight both dating back through many many past Generations

2:30:39

portions of it to 1914 possibly portions of it to 1824 we

2:30:45

can’t do the work that we can do without getting this roof fixed it’s a gaping hole and a potential catastrophe looming

2:30:51

literally over our heads that’s why we’re here before you to ask for support for this article now let me just tell

2:30:56

you a little bit about our Museum according to the American Alliance of museums which is the industry standard

2:31:03

in the museum field there are an estimated 33 000 museums across our

2:31:09

country and only 1103 of them are accredited well Pilgrim Hall Museum has

2:31:15

that distinction and to achieve that that means we have to go through a very stringent process of peer review to

2:31:21

demonstrate that we meet benchmarks of excellence in all areas of Museum operations governance Financial

2:31:27

oversight education and stewardship we support our own operating budget it’s

2:31:34

in the vicinity this year of eight hundred and forty thousand dollars it has varied a little bit in the last

2:31:39

couple of years due to the circumstances of the pandemic and we support that entirely ourselves through admissions

2:31:45

programs membership fundraising and other activities our mission broadly is to serve as an

2:31:51

educational resource on Plymouth history especially its early history we do so for a wide range of audiences at home

2:31:57

and further afield in addition to exhibitions we provide educational and research resources for

2:32:03

hundreds of academics students independent researchers we offer public

2:32:09

programs and lectures many of you have enjoyed such things as the free monthly Burial Hill tours that we do in

2:32:15

collaboration with our wonderful partners and colleagues of the Plymouth and Aquarian Society we have an

2:32:20

incredible speaker Series this year that’s open free to the public we’ve got a great lecture coming up of the

2:32:26

Mayflower genealogist next week and we’ve done this year after year generation after generation general

2:32:32

admission is free to individuals and families who live in Plymouth we also offer a free day annually to all members

2:32:39

of the public to come and we had several hundreds who visited us last Friday for our birthday celebration

2:32:44

we’ve been a destination venue for Plymouth since 1824. we played a

2:32:50

fundamental role in the development of Plymouth as a tourist destination we

2:32:56

were involved in the preservation of Plymouth Rock and as Bill pointed out and I just would

2:33:03

like to reiterate we’ve really shaped the historic Plymouth that all of us I think value and appreciate today our

2:33:10

organization was the one that independently purchased lot by lot all

2:33:15

of the lands along Cole’s Hill along Water Street North Street Carver Street

2:33:21

with our own resources in order to preserve that area and make

2:33:26

it a commemorative space and then we donated that to the Commonwealth we

2:33:31

built designed funded the National Monument to the forefathers

2:33:37

so even if you’ve never sat through the doors of that museum building you

2:33:43

probably have experienced some of the contributions that this organization has made to our community if you sat and watched the fireworks on

2:33:50

Cole’s Hill or if you’ve gone and admired the the Monumental

2:33:56

forefathers building um we’re very active in our local community we partner with all kinds of

2:34:02

different organizations in our cultural Community we take great pride in those relationships and value our partnership

2:34:07

with many organizations Plymouth historical Alliance Backroads is South Shore the Plymouth Bay Cultural District

2:34:13

Plymouth integration Society the plymouthville uh all kinds of places and we’re open to other Partnerships as well

2:34:19

so bring ideas to us please we are coming to you now with a request for CPC funding it’s much more than a

2:34:27

simple roof project it ties together many essential conservation and

2:34:32

preservation needs of this building that are created by an actual crisis of a

2:34:37

failing roof in Skylight and we’re approaching this in two phases we’re bringing you our first phase of work

2:34:43

that is a about a 5.27 million dollar project we’re asking for 3.2 million in

2:34:50

community preservation funds and we’re going to bring the remainder of that to the table and part of that is to afford

2:34:56

the work of just clearing the r artworks that are massive and have been in place

2:35:01

in some cases for 170 years or more have not been moved this is going to be very specialized work that portion of the

2:35:07

project is in the vicinity between moving and storing and the conservation work that we’ve had estimated uh I don’t

2:35:13

know if that ended up in your packet but we do have a full estimate from a conservator on all that work and we’d be

2:35:19

happy to supply that with you of about a half a million dollars so if we’re going to invest a half a million dollars in

2:35:25

emptying that room in order to do the work that we need to do we need to make certain that we’re doing everything we can at that space at one time so we are

2:35:32

doing the HVAC work that we need to care for the building and the collections in it we’re doing the lighting work with

2:35:38

which is also a conservation related building system and to fit these parts

2:35:45

of this complicated project together we’re working with David Peck who’s the chair of our facilities and properties

2:35:52

committee and Lynn Spencer of Spencer preservation group they’re just going to run through a couple of the details with

2:35:57

you and then we’d be very happy to answer any questions that you might have thank you thank you Ms Curtin

2:36:04

Mr Peck good evening again David Peck I’m chairman of the

2:36:12

trustee and a chairman of the properties committee at Pilgrim Hall but also the town’s building committee and a retired

2:36:18

architect I’ve been involved with Pilgrim Hall since about 2017 2018

2:36:26

stewarding the building which as you just heard is 199 years old the building

2:36:32

itself is not just its collections but the building itself is a something to be

2:36:40

proud of and is part of the collection it was designed by Alexander Paris who

2:36:45

is the same architect who did Quincy Market he was one of the Premier

2:36:50

architects in New England in the early 19th century we’ve been the properties committee has

2:36:57

been paying very attention attention starting in 2017 2018 with the in

2:37:04

increasing evidence of moisture coming in when I first joined as a trustee it

2:37:12

was clear in the main hall through the flaking paint all over the floor that sometimes would

2:37:18

even hit people’s shoulders that we had a a major moisture migration issue by

2:37:25

2020 and 2021 we had puddles on the floor of the main Gallery Peter Brown

2:37:32

our President we would make sure we had to get visitors to walk around the

2:37:38

puddles we’ve had buckets in the main lobby so it’s become

2:37:44

increasingly urgent that the roof wall-to-wall be be addressed

2:37:51

so I to that end we started we put an RFP out

2:37:57

for an architect you’ll hear from her in a minute from Spencer preservation we

2:38:04

did interview several but the selected architect is the same one who worked on the Spire which is underway now the

2:38:11

meeting house and the 1749 courthouse so she’s familiar with Plymouth and the the

2:38:17

uh the environment of the contractor environment here

2:38:22

we’ve also included lighting and Engineers the engineers the same Engineers who worked on this building

2:38:30

ggd Engineers so we have a good team looking at

2:38:36

looking at this uh we went to the CPC a year ago June 24th

2:38:42

2022 for roof and skylight replacement as

2:38:47

well as related infrastructure the CPC a year ago tabled our request uh

2:38:54

but we had our team together so we have actually spent the last year going to

2:39:00

much more detail whether to keep the Skylight or replace the effect the very promising effect of

2:39:09

a good Skylight but not having a skylight that could leak and as you’ll see in some of the images we

2:39:17

actually have we are proposing to rearrange the ductwork and add new

2:39:22

lighting so it really restores uh a 199 year old space will be 200 years when uh

2:39:31

or 201 by the time we finish this project but really we’re store the main gallery to its uh original appearance

2:39:39

I’d point out just coming back to the history of the building besides being uh

2:39:45

designed by a noted New England architect at the lower level served as

2:39:52

the girls high school for the town for at least 20 years the main Gallery was the public library reading room for 20

2:39:59

or 30 years at the end of the 1800s the building played an important part in

2:40:05

the ter Centennial the 1920 and even in the church and telling of the country in

2:40:10

1976. so besides being part of plymouth’s History it’s also part of the

2:40:17

country’s history in terms of our celebration of the pilgrims and their meaning to it uh

2:40:24

as you know from towns building committee getting a serious handle on costs is

2:40:30

something we’re committed to so we have invited our numbers roof

2:40:36

numbers are based on input from two roofing contractors have

2:40:43

worked here capeway Roofing did the Nathaniel Morton a year ago we had their

2:40:48

people up on the roof giving us a good number they’re also working on one of the fire

2:40:53

stations right now and we’ve had Greenwood Roofing also looking at it and

2:40:59

giving us a number they did the library and they’re now doing the three elementary schools which are in the home stretch as we speak

2:41:06

school opened on time so we wanted the real professionals not just the paper

2:41:13

pushers I hate to call sometimes people who desert you know do their construction estimates on paper you know

2:41:19

they were up in the ladder checking it you know the we have partly a slate roof slate roof is literally shedding onto

2:41:27

the lower roofs sometimes embedding themselves in the lower roof so everything is really old partly old

2:41:36

or nearing the end of its useful life on the roof but we have good numbers we’re

2:41:42

also including contingencies and escalation we’ve just heard in one or

2:41:47

two of the other comments that construction costs are both unpredictable especially over the

2:41:54

last couple years and it’s wise to have contingency the rest of our numbers have come from CVI contractors and they are

2:42:02

the ones building the Spire as we speak so they’ve given us real world numbers

2:42:08

as well um so as I say the properties committee and

2:42:14

the trustees take our stewardship responsibility seriously where we would

2:42:20

like to celebrate the 200th anniversary of the building but we want it to be here for the 300th anniversary so we

2:42:26

need to put a high quality roof on it and make the interior

2:42:31

Renovations that flow from doing a roof

2:42:36

carefully so the the need is urgent the estimated costs are realistic I urge you

2:42:45

we urge you to support it and with that I would like to introduce Lynn Spencer our architect

2:42:52

thank you David I’d like to call for the seventh inning stretch I’m sure all of you would love

2:42:59

to have a little bit of that but if you’ll bear with me I’ll take you through some of these images

2:43:06

as David has indicated we’ve had experience in Plymouth before we worked

2:43:12

on the national Pilgrim Meeting House the 1749 Courthouse we’re on the Spire

2:43:17

center now we do this work by actually getting deeply involved so the images

2:43:24

that you’re seeing on this slide are a result of a lift survey that I with my

2:43:30

colleague Doug Manley did over a year ago you have a roof that actually probably

2:43:38

dates from the late 19th century we see a skylight that was introduced in

2:43:45

1914. imagine being in the the gallery here

2:43:51

in the early days what was the source of Illumination natural light

2:43:56

so what happened is that as the

2:44:01

the hall evolved over time and David’s book about the original architect

2:44:06

Alexander Parrish but other Architects came into the mix and their concepts of

2:44:13

how to treat these galleries changed so the main Gallery was once illuminated by

2:44:19

daylight Through the Windows they were filled in so there could be more wall

2:44:26

space for gallery display and the Skylight was introduced as a way of providing some natural daylight that

2:44:33

Skylight along with the roof was a real focus of our invest initial investigation

2:44:43

there it is up close so what is the Skylight it’s the letting natural light in but it is also

2:44:52

letting enormous potential of water penetration we think that it was probably initially

2:45:00

covered over during World War II to block the any light coming out of the

2:45:06

building because of the concern about protection during the war

2:45:12

over time the Skylight has proved to leak

2:45:17

sometimes intermittently sometimes persistently and then the building

2:45:22

committee several years ago had it fully covered with a membrane to sort of forestall you know to hold back the

2:45:30

water we’re also looking at that slate roof and it’s a little bit difficult to see

2:45:36

given the lighting in this room but if you look carefully at that roof you will see areas of brown I don’t know if I’ve

2:45:44

got another image here now you’ll see areas that look like almost a brown slate and we looked at this and said oh

2:45:51

what is that all about well that’s because what is slate it’s a sedimentary material it’s compressed clay compressed

2:46:00

over the ends but when the Slate depending on the quality of the slates

2:46:06

begins to degrade it does so by shailing off you can actually see the sedimentary

2:46:12

layers exposed to the elements and so our job was to say not only what to do

2:46:20

with the Skylight what is a sensible recommendation but with it we looked at

2:46:25

the roof itself which was well past the end of its service life

2:46:32

as we wrestled with this Skylight we at we were in a situation where we were not

2:46:40

only looking at you know what it means for visitors in the gallery not to expect any water or have to step around

2:46:47

puddles but we were actually you know shaken by in fact the responsibility of

2:46:54

preserving the artifacts the works of art the Irreplaceable objects that are

2:47:00

in this gallery and here you’re seeing an image of what we are envisioning

2:47:07

as David has alluded to Donna mentioned we have a couple of things what to do

2:47:13

with skylight after numerous building committee meetings and a lot of sort of

2:47:19

hand-wringing true handwringing because the skyline is in fact a character

2:47:24

defining feature it is something that is important for the architectural Integrity of the building but our job

2:47:31

was to not only preserve the Integrity but to ensure the longevity of the investment and after considerable debate

2:47:39

We Came Upon This solution a cover the Skylight allow the sort of the if you

2:47:47

will the path of the Skylight to exist both within the gallery as well as

2:47:54

outside what what can we do we are proposing to entirely replace the

2:48:01

slate roof with a high quality Vermont structural black slate and then

2:48:08

to cover this like the Skylight itself with with copper that way

2:48:14

the Skylight as a feature is preserved but it is made weather tight

2:48:20

for the protection of the the collections within as I said it’s an it’s a it’s a heavy responsibility and

2:48:27

it’s one that the museum and the trustees take very seriously we cannot

2:48:32

allow water into this space we need to be able to control not to control

2:48:38

daylight which actually can cause objects to degrade because of ultraviolet light

2:48:44

so the solution is cover the skylight on the outside but preserve the quality of

2:48:50

it with through an Innovative lighting system designed by lamb lighting and

2:48:55

that is basically LED lights embedded in a sheet material that can be set to

2:49:01

different settings it’s an economical and respectful way of

2:49:06

treating this this important feature we also had recommended relocating the

2:49:13

linear duct which you see in the image on the upper right that is now centered along the the peak

2:49:20

of the roof and we’re moving the we’re removing it and creating two ducts oval

2:49:26

shapes that are you see aligned threaded through the uh the the iron trusses that

2:49:33

hold that roof up that affords another opportunity to provide sensitive

2:49:38

lighting that actually can be integrated into that into the into the ducts of the

2:49:44

sides of the ducts so short story

2:49:50

there’s more to this Museum in the adjoining Library we will also be

2:49:56

protecting the roof over that area which is a membrane roof as well as the

2:50:02

replacing the roofs over the the 2008 Edition

2:50:08

we’re doing that with a thermal welded seam roof but in within the library itself we’re using this occasion to

2:50:16

enhance the lighting as well as allow lighting to now exist with the skylights

2:50:22

with it the stained glass windows at the end of the room

2:50:28

what does it mean to do this work it’s work that requires not only a very well

2:50:36

developed set of contract documents plans and specifications but a well-developed sense of schedule and

2:50:43

respect for the Museum’s operation and the public while this is taking place so

2:50:50

with this I will turn it back over to Donna who will talk in Greater detail

2:50:56

about what it means to protect the uh the collection while the construction is taking place

2:51:04

and just very briefly I know it’s a long evening but as you can see the main hall is the repository of the

2:51:12

greater part of the collection of artwork that’s been in the care of the museum some of those pieces have been on

2:51:17

display since we opened 199 years ago and they are too large to fit through

2:51:22

the door so they must be taken apart so in consultation with a conservator

2:51:30

who actually conserved the large Sergeant painting on the rear wall of the museum back in 2014 at that was

2:51:38

funded by the Commonwealth of Massachusetts at the tune of about a quarter of a million dollars for one painting

2:51:45

um he’s recommended that it is possible for us to remove these other canvases from their frames

2:51:51

to treat them uh in sort of a partial measure

2:51:58

roll them up remove them from the building bring them to the conservation lab where they can

2:52:04

have some additional restoration work done we will keep the large frames in place and the restored painting that was

2:52:11

done in 2014 in place in a micro climate enclosure that has to have humidity and

2:52:18

temperature controls in order to ensure that the artwork isn’t damaged but the

2:52:24

logistics of emptying out that room are going to be considerable it’s going to be expensive and the goal of the

2:52:30

organization is to continue to have public access to the building in the

2:52:35

other galleries that are not impacted by this work so we plan to have Pilgrim Hall Museum remain open during this

2:52:43

logistically challenging time and we do anticipate that some visitors

2:52:50

may not wish to visit us because not all the galleries will be available for viewing so in our budget you will see we

2:52:56

have factored in a very modest amount of money for some lost Revenue that isn’t anything we’re asking CPC to fund that’s

2:53:03

part of what we expect to have to be able to replace in order to support continuing operations during this

2:53:11

project but that number was put in there because we think it’s a realistic assessment of the financial burden that

2:53:16

we’re going to face as we tackle this project the overall cost of this phase

2:53:21

of the project with all the elements that Lynn described is 5.27 million as I

2:53:26

said before we’re asking CBC for a large amount of that 3.2 million in the past

2:53:31

20 years we have received CPC funds three times before for a total of 565

2:53:37

thousand dollars and with that seed money that was given to us for other projects we’ve done we were able to

2:53:45

successfully complete capital projects in excess of five million dollars so that was a pretty good return we think

2:53:52

on that seed money that CPC gave us the match in this case is larger we’ve just

2:53:57

come through the period of the pandemic it hasn’t been an easy time for any cultural organization and this is just

2:54:03

so much more critical because it really does impact our ability to care for these things in an immediate way

2:54:08

we’re happy to take any questions and thank you for your time thank you any questions from any members

2:54:15

of the board for any of the presenters we’ve already heard

2:54:21

Mr blesser

2:54:29

yes I want to make a comment then I have a question for Donna I was lucky enough

2:54:34

last year I met with the delegate the delegation from Ireland that came over and the the

2:54:42

county this the sister County from Ireland uh was coming over to meet the officials

2:54:50

from Plymouth County and they called me in advance and wanted to know they had to have somewhere

2:54:57

to to to have this event somewhere to you know have lunch and

2:55:03

they needed some way historic and I spent absolutely this is the place they chose

2:55:10

the the museum and we had we had a great day my first time I have to admit well

2:55:16

my first time probably in a long time that I went in there and you gave me a tour and my eyes were open to to what’s

2:55:24

in that museum I never realized the Irreplaceable artifacts in there it was

2:55:30

it was great what I learned the the the Irish delegation was just they they

2:55:35

loved it they loved the whole experience and they were here to talk about Derek uh time manager was there they were

2:55:42

talking about the blue economy and tourism so it was a

2:55:47

it was an important meeting and it was topped off with visiting that museum is

2:55:53

very important to them so the question that I’m going to segue

2:55:58

into my question you showed me some artifacts there that forget about what’s what’s out but

2:56:04

what about the the stuff you can’t display you’ll you have a ship from the

2:56:11

1600s that from from down in Eastham I believe it is that that you you can’t even

2:56:18

display it you don’t have the room to display it and and that that amazed me right there

2:56:24

and also you were afraid to put some artifacts out because they’re gonna they’re gonna get destroyed by by water

2:56:31

so this is a very serious uh renovation that you need there and I

2:56:37

just want to say that that museum is so important to our tourism we have Lee

2:56:42

Filson out there she can she can agree with that it’s so important to our tourism

2:56:48

in fact you know I suggest that every Motel uh restaurant

2:56:55

every business in town Hotel bed and breakfast at brochures and tell people

2:57:01

when they’re visiting Plymouth to go see that museum because it’s really it it’s it’s amazing the things

2:57:08

you’re going to learn there I mean I learned so much in my hour visit to that museum so it’s very important we don’t

2:57:15

have enough uh events or things for tourists that do

2:57:21

in Plymouth this is one uh the museum is so important and that building is is so

2:57:28

important to our downtown the only request I and I’ve said this to you before is I wish

2:57:33

we could staff at seven days a week so people could could visit seven days a

2:57:39

week but I know the staffing issues and uh but it’s very important and and again

2:57:44

I’m going to say like I said before that this is exactly what we should be using CPA monies for I really believe that so

2:57:51

I’m all in favor of this but can you explain about some of the what I just asked about some of the artifacts and

2:57:57

some of the things that you can’t put up we have a large um a large collection and a small

2:58:04

Gallery space so there are always going to be a rotation of things that are on display and we do try to rotate some of

2:58:10

these things but we have some amazing things that are quite unique including one of the oldest Colonial shipwrecks in

2:58:17

America and that is the remains of a vessel recovered off Cape Cod during the Civil War that dates to the late 16th

2:58:23

early 17th century and we believe it to be the vessel referenced by William Bradford carrying the very first Irish

2:58:29

to Plymouth Colony believe it or not there was a little group of Irish folks here in Plymouth for about a year and we

2:58:35

think it is the remains of that vessel and we’ve done a lot of research on that and someday we hope to have a special exhibition where that would be displayed

2:58:42

uh and the public would be able to enjoy it again this very high interest in that

2:58:47

particular object but there are Myriad and one things that we could talk about in The Collection I will say I was very

2:58:53

happy that you took a recent tour and remember Charlie we are free to Plymouth residents so any Plymouth resident can

2:58:59

walk through and they will really be amazed at what is in there especially if they haven’t passed their outdoors in a

2:59:06

few years listen I my fellow board members if you haven’t been there get a tour go see this Museum

2:59:13

it’s it’s phenomenal so it’s a must-see I believe we work very closely with C Plymouth there do all kinds of wonderful

2:59:20

collaborative marketing that we can afford as a small institution we’re very grateful to have our you can get hair we

2:59:26

can kick it in free yes Harry can come in Mary has gotten in free in the past

2:59:35

okay uh apropos of nothing members of the board are encouraged to restrict

2:59:40

discussion to discussion and I will give members of the board as much time as they’d like during discussion to make

2:59:46

discussion but with that in mind does any member of the board have any questions Mr Mahoney did you have a

2:59:52

question yeah just uh Donna I just

2:59:58

I just want to make sure that you follow up with the finance director obviously one of the benefits to this project is

3:00:04

that the construction timeline is going to be September October of 24 through the spring of 25 correct

3:00:11

okay so even though this is a big ask and I I do support it the benefit here

3:00:17

is that I hope God willing the CPC in April respond to rate debt pay-down article so

3:00:23

that you don’t need the money until about 12 months from now and that process I I would certainly

3:00:29

advise you to sit down with a finance director to see exactly how that process works

3:00:35

and you know God willing we will be able to take that 3.2 in April

3:00:41

you know to a lower figure and then obviously that those would be against fy25

3:00:47

revenues and then in April 25 hopefully uh go to Tom meeting for another ass to

3:00:52

pay that down even further upon completion of the project against FY 26 and significantly reducing you know

3:00:59

obviously with the committee’s approval uh the uh the 3.2 million dollar exposure our architect has designed the project

3:01:06

to be phased so the work is phased so we will not need cash flow for a year from the vote of town meeting and some of the

3:01:13

earliest work will be the portions of the project that the society that Pilgrim Hall Museum will be funding in

3:01:19

some of the removal of the artwork in the conservation work so there may be even a little bit more of a cushion on

3:01:24

the cash flow that would be required from CPC funds so that does give a little bit of relief in order to to

3:01:32

alleviate borrowing need as CPC funds are replenished on an annual basis and I

3:01:40

believe the estimates are about 4.5 to 5 million coming in annually for CPC over the next several years

3:01:47

thank you any other questions from any other members of the board Mr helm so

3:01:54

um according to Mr Peck signs of the degradation severe

3:01:59

degradation of the roof began in 2017.

3:02:04

um when was the RFP for this work put out I would say that there’s a little

3:02:11

bit of misunderstanding Active water in the main hall was actually not noticed until late 2021 Harry there had been

3:02:20

some flaking paint that was not really uh the interior of the Skylight had been painted but that wasn’t really

3:02:27

recognized as a moisture problem as a critical problem right away and you have to realize that this part of the

3:02:33

building is 32 feet high and the only way for us to access the inside of it is

3:02:38

to bring a scissor this one scissor lift that will fit through the doors of the original main hall building and we did

3:02:45

when we did some paint work in 20 might have been just before the

3:02:51

pandemic we did some paint work 2019 but even then it was not clear that that

3:02:56

there were moisture problems I mean obviously paint painted on the inside of Glass isn’t necessarily A a good level

3:03:05

of adherence um but it was in November of 2021 in the fall of 2021 we were actually having an

3:03:11

event in the building um that had been rescheduled from the 2020 commemoration activities that were

3:03:17

supposed to take place on Coles Hill I think was October of 21 actually and they they got rained out with a

3:03:22

hurricane and asked for a place to have their ceremony their remembrance ceremony they had it in the museum we

3:03:28

accommodated that request and during that rain is when we first saw rainfall so it’s been a shorter time for us to

3:03:35

actually have been addressing uh the seriousness of this problem and we have

3:03:41

been up on our roof and all around our building David is the chair of our

3:03:48

properties and Facilities committees takes our committee out on an annual uh

3:03:54

multiple times a year annual walkthrough of the building and maintains a facilities and maintenance schedule for

3:04:02

us it’s not that wonderful 20-year version that was Grant funded for uh the Art Guild and we’re a little jealous of

3:04:08

that but we do have a pretty robust uh maintenance and repair program and it is

3:04:15

monitored um Mr Peck would you like to explain why you said that in 2017 you first started

3:04:22

seeing signs of moisture penetration and it wasn’t just chipping pain uh no like it was chipping paint and just to

3:04:29

correct my boss here uh it wasn’t just coming off the skylights it was coming

3:04:35

off the main ceiling at both ends you mentioned you mentioned degradation of plaster yeah it was so the seal the

3:04:42

whether it was thick paint or plaster there were flakes coming down at both

3:04:48

ends beyond the Skylight which is why we repainted in 2019 and it

3:04:56

took us a while we had we had to get several painters to give us a bid she

3:05:02

was saying it’s very hard for the painters to get up to 32 feet

3:05:07

but that started we also bought a moisture meter that you can put up

3:05:13

against masonry walls and plaster walls and measure the the moisture in it and even though sometimes you wouldn’t see

3:05:20

things you might see some bubbling paint but there are many areas in the older

3:05:25

building where it goes off the meter if anybody’s ever used a moisture meter so

3:05:31

the hints were coming 2017-2018 we got the ceiling repainted

3:05:37

in 2019 also adding to the timeline

3:05:43

we did some HVAC work during the 2020

3:05:49

coveted break would actually in one way it was good that we had covered so we

3:05:54

had time to do it but that’s when some buckets were needed in the lobby and one

3:06:00

or two other spots so that it’s been it’s been a growing

3:06:06

sort of exponential set of signs that uh

3:06:12

you know the roof is failing in different ways okay you know I I mentioned the old slate roof and it’s

3:06:18

you know Lynn mentioned the look at it was a little hard to see in that but you

3:06:24

know individual pieces are sliding off and then sticking in the roof so I’ve got a picture showing it at 90 degrees

3:06:30

from the roof because it penetrated the roof we’ve had to use lots of tubes of caulk around the Skylight and around

3:06:39

other things over the last couple years and we put the big I’ll call it the big

3:06:44

Band-Aid over the Skylight so it’s a it’s a rubber roof over the entire

3:06:50

Skylight which has worked knock on wood uh but it’s just sending us messages

3:06:56

it’s become it’s risen to the top of uh our many needs but it’s the absolute

3:07:04

priority uh because we don’t want to keep band-aiding it and and supporting the industry

3:07:10

I certainly understand so in 2017 these hints and messages and uh water damage

3:07:21

um be started to become evident yet there was no concern that the roof which

3:07:28

was near nearing a hundred years old might need to be replaced in the near future no

3:07:35

there was concern but slate roofs last a long time even when they look like

3:07:42

they’ve aged a little bit and so uh the hints were there and the sort of

3:07:48

growing number of hints but that was part of our sort of longer term look I

3:07:55

mean we we in fact in 2017 did complete engineering assessment engineering

3:08:00

report from the same Engineers by the way ggd as sort of a kickoff of understanding

3:08:07

our longer term facility needs but as I say so roof you know we could look at it

3:08:13

in 2017 2018 but it wasn’t creating puddles until 2021. okay but

3:08:21

so the hints and messages were not paid attention until until there were buckets needed so starting in 2017

3:08:29

okay there was no idea that coming up

3:08:34

was going to be a three million dollar expenditure

3:08:40

sure again Jump Right In yeah yeah because I have some questions for you too so

3:08:45

here’s how we do we go about things because you’ve been hearing from David they were seeing evidence of plaster

3:08:52

flaking and so on from within what did we do we brought in an aerial lift we

3:08:57

were up there on a 90-foot lift so we could go all over that roof we could look at the gutters we could look at the

3:09:04

state of the Slate we can actually lift up areas around the Skylight and it was really that effort which was sponsored

3:09:10

by the building committee and the trustees that gave Clarity to the state of that roof okay and that Clarity was

3:09:17

the state of the roof is that it needs A-Okay no that’s no the state of the

3:09:22

roof is that it needs to be replaced in full okay and as I mentioned that we are

3:09:28

recommended when and that was about when I began our work in 2022. so 20 so there

3:09:35

were uh five years where things were just um progressing

3:09:42

well again I would say again when I came on board 2017 2018 and I saw the flaking

3:09:48

paint that ended up being you know repaired and replaced it could

3:09:53

have been an old leak it could have happened who knows when in the life of the so that’s when it sort of raised the

3:10:00

issue I will also say we asked Lynn you know because when Lynn was working on

3:10:05

the the meeting house we asked the architect in the I forget what the name

3:10:11

of the company was that worked in the meeting house to go up on the roof and give us advice so we’ve been Gathering

3:10:16

advice uh that this is coming uh but that’s you know it’s a process and

3:10:24

it accelerated in 2022 that’s why I went to the CPC a year ago with all the drawings that were shown by

3:10:32

Lynn so we weren’t ignoring it we were increasingly anxious

3:10:38

oh that’s very interesting interesting phraseology

3:10:45

um Lynn on your cost estimate sheet that you gave us

3:10:51

when I look at the cost estimates and I take basically page one of the cost

3:10:56

estimates and figure with some I’ll give you some latitude um things like protection of objects in

3:11:02

the main gallery and Library signage Logistics disposal Insurance 85

3:11:08

000 and I go through all of these division one division two four I even

3:11:14

allow for the repointing of two brick Chimneys in four then you get to Seven

3:11:21

which is actually the one million four hundred thousand dollars for the roof okay then there is

3:11:28

um eight which is frame and sheathing for Skylight infill but it also includes

3:11:34

framing for the lighting system but I’ll give you that as well um and 09

3:11:39

um is drywall framing taping Skylight in Fall prep and paint the main Gallery

3:11:45

which I’ll give you terrazzo floor restoration from the water pouring through the roof I got yes

3:11:52

um so go ahead excuse me I could just jump in the Toronto floor restoration is

3:11:58

not related we don’t think to the water pouring in or being collected in buckets

3:12:04

but more one of the functions of Terrazzo is it cracks over time as

3:12:09

building movement takes place and I think that that’s more likely because it’s fair enough but uh you know I just

3:12:15

yeah I’m I’m going you know I’m looking at the cost sure so if I just take page

3:12:23

one which has some license in it to the benefit of the costs of things that

3:12:28

aren’t really like repointing to Brick chimneys uh relative to the roof I come

3:12:34

to um one million six hundred and sixty six thousand one hundred dollars okay I then

3:12:42

if I go to page two and add in uh the 129 thousand dollars for main Gallery

3:12:49

packing handling Tran transport conservation and also excess value insurance which

3:12:58

goes hand in hand with I’m imagining the work involved in replacing the roof okay I add that on and I come to one million

3:13:06

795 700 for the roof project did you catch the HVAC cost yeah but I’m

3:13:15

not that’s the HVAC that’s not the roof okay I don’t know what I’m trying to divide out here is what is the actual

3:13:22

cost of the roof because this is being presented as a

3:13:28

we are on the edge of a really bad disaster like situation in our very

3:13:36

important Museum and I am not questioning the importance of the museum okay as as

3:13:43

somebody who has Pilgrim forebearers okay whose family comes from here

3:13:48

originally I understand the importance of our history and I understand what the pilgrim Hall Museum stands for and means

3:13:56

across the country so I’m not questioning that what I’m questioning is asking three million two hundred

3:14:03

thousand dollars of the taxpayers of Plymouth when a roof actually from my

3:14:09

calculations comes in at a let’s say a million eight hundred thousand dollars okay that is one million four hundred

3:14:16

thousand dollars more than the replacement of the roof right so did you also add in the general

3:14:24

conditions overhead and profit insurances I just I’m just curious I added I added in the

3:14:32

um I added in the the the things that are listed here yeah um I did not add in

3:14:39

conservation of objects and artwork by qualified conservators um I didn’t the loss of Revenue I didn’t

3:14:46

include um to the to the main Gallery because I have a question about that but that’s a

3:14:52

whole different thing um the new exhibit fabrication and installation in the main Gallery the

3:14:58

exhibit designed for the entire Museum the lighting for the main gallery and

3:15:03

Library nor the AC system from the main Gallery in life I all of the others from

3:15:09

your cost estimate are included in that okay so if there was something missing from the cost estimates I did not

3:15:15

include it right so what I was what I was trying to actually lead in to lead

3:15:22

the discussion towards is when we’re dealing with the Skylight we’re also dealing with the the linear diffuser

3:15:28

related to the hvaces the HVAC system and we’re we’re also dealing with the

3:15:35

lighting to me they’re integrated now I understand you know you’re just trying to drill down on the roof and I

3:15:41

appreciate that but our task as The Architects and designers working with

3:15:47

this was to look at an integrated project and in indeed the museum and the

3:15:54

trustees are actually raising considerable funds towards this project

3:15:59

and let’s let’s talk about that because that goes to the heart of why I asked

3:16:05

about 2017 and I saw in the materials I

3:16:10

got that fundraising did not begin until June of 2023 three months ago

3:16:19

well not exactly Mr Helm because it is in the materials Donna

3:16:26

um we didn’t know in 2017 that we were facing this need what we saw were you

3:16:34

know evidence of some paint failure in a room that could happen in your own house

3:16:40

and you might think it’s a lousy paint job I mean it’s 32 feet high up above you and I don’t know when the room was

3:16:46

last painted I believe probably was 2008. it’s not an easy room to paint so flaking paint is not necessarily an

3:16:53

immediate indication that you’re going to have to replace your roof uh I had started my position at the

3:16:59

Museum in 2016. I can tell you in 2017 I didn’t even know how Ruth how old the

3:17:04

roof was and I still can’t answer that for you clearly today because there are

3:17:09

many different portions of that roof that have been replaced piecemeal over time

3:17:15

so we have as I say a very robust system of Maintenance we’ve had roofers on the

3:17:21

roof many a time there are multiple little areas that have been leaking probably for a long time and we look to

3:17:27

find those it’s an old building it’s going to be 200 years old this is not uncommon but to determine the nature and

3:17:34

scope of a problem takes time to investigate uh in 2018

3:17:40

uh we restored the Steinway library that was one of the years we did receive a

3:17:45

grant of 125 000 of CPC funds towards the restoration of the west of Vino tile ceiling at that point we were looking at

3:17:52

the roofing area on the the 1905 portion of the building and there were some issues with that that were repaired at

3:17:58

that time but what we have seen and it is certainly something that has extended

3:18:04

back well beyond 2017. I could say it’s you know probably extend back for the last century or more is a piecemeal

3:18:10

approach and it is we cannot there’s no more Integrity to this Patchwork and

3:18:16

that is the realization that we came to when we started to have active water in

3:18:21

the building falling within a couple of feet of some of these uh iconic artworks that this is this is a much more serious

3:18:28

problem despite a very constant level of care there are just times when your knee

3:18:33

gives out and you need to go to the surgeon and he’s going to tell you it’s time to replace it well that’s what’s

3:18:39

happened to us and it’s not because we haven’t exercised our knee now we we you know we’ve looked carefully at this

3:18:45

building and we monitor it and we take it seriously because we consider it to be an asset and Treasure of this town

3:18:52

and so yes we do invest in it I wish in 2017 I could have had a crystal ball maybe we’d have caught this sooner maybe

3:18:58

it could have been done for a lot less expense but that’s just not the way it happened and I think we showed due diligence at

3:19:04

every stage of the way so you know I hope that addresses if you have some underlying

3:19:10

concern about how we care for this building

3:19:15

I don’t have underlying concern about how you care for the building I just have underlying concern about the

3:19:21

timeline of this roof quite frankly the roof is the single most important aspect

3:19:29

of it is a structure I mean I will tell you that the Veterans Administration and

3:19:36

the FHA will not give a loan to a homeowner if the roof is not up to

3:19:41

standard I mean so they understand that the roof is important and I’m just questioning let’s forget about 2017 and

3:19:48

the few years spent like just not really thinking about it my question is I

3:19:56

noticed in the materials that fundraising for this project or anything

3:20:02

around the roof or anything like that knowing let’s say 2021 this was a

3:20:08

problem because you were putting buckets out did not begin until June of 2023

3:20:13

which is just a few months ago that doesn’t mean that expense was not incurred and paid for because from that

3:20:20

time forward all of this investigation I don’t get up on the roof and do it we’ve brought in multiple organizations we’ve

3:20:28

we paid for uh you know earlier on design and Engineering work and other

3:20:33

work and all of these things have been additional expenses that our organization has incurred to be able to

3:20:38

to develop plans and specs all of that fundraising has been done and we’re not bringing that to you at this point in

3:20:44

time we’ve funded that independently already so it’s not quite accurate to say we haven’t been fundraising to try

3:20:50

to address these problems we have been and we’ve been expending that money to develop the project project development

3:20:55

is expensive and we have raised money for that now now that we know

3:21:01

what our actual costs are based on real world estimates I can actually launch a

3:21:08

capital campaign because it’s very difficult to do that when you don’t know exactly how much money you need to raise so we have started in a more concerted

3:21:17

way to raise funds because we need to come up with 2.1 million in match for

3:21:23

this first phase of a project that is has a larger component that we’re also going to address so we’re moving forward

3:21:28

on two fronts raising money for the 2.1 that we need to match the 3.2 that we’re

3:21:34

asking for and that is what has begun aggressively this year

3:21:40

we received other funds and monies that were expended toward this project but they’re not they

3:21:46

were that pre-development work so I’m not including those in this effort

3:21:51

since June when we started fundraising specifically for this phase of the

3:21:58

project right now we have 680 excuse me

3:22:03

639 thousand dollars that we have raised we have also raised for our larger

3:22:09

project the additional scope that is not included in what we’re doing with the town another two hundred thousand

3:22:16

dollars for that work that will affect our archives when we are able to reach

3:22:21

phase two so since June we have raised eight hundred thousand dollars and I

3:22:27

would say that’s a pretty good amount of money for us to do for a small organization like ours and it gives me

3:22:32

confidence that as we go forward we will be able to be successful and a year from now when we need to have that cash flow

3:22:38

in the end we will be able to proceed with this project work thank you you’re

3:22:44

welcome any other questions from any other member

3:22:51

members Mr Mahoney has moved that we recommend town meeting approve article 9 D is

3:22:59

there a second I’ll second it has been seconded any discussion from any members

3:23:04

of the board as to whether or not we should recommend town meeting approve article 9d

3:23:12

Mr quintal I’ll be brief I know it’s late I’m going

3:23:18

to say that I got a call from Mr Brown to come down there a couple months ago and Donna was kind

3:23:25

enough to take me through the building and uh check your time we took our time and we went through the whole thing a

3:23:32

lot of what Charlie saw is what I saw and you know I’m going to support this

3:23:37

whole auditly um it’s a great piece of History

3:23:43

for our community and not going to get in all that right now be in the hour but this shouldn’t surprise you the town is

3:23:51

famous for doing just the patchwork this is the same story you’re going to hear

3:23:57

in every building bow and fall with until this community and I hope Tom

3:24:02

Eaton’s really listening starts setting up a plan to stop maintaining our

3:24:07

buildings and I’m not going to go on for hours but it comes right to me

3:24:13

I think was last year the year before Nathaniel Martin needed their roof done I went and spoke before various

3:24:21

committees in favor of that project and thank goodness it’s being done and it looks

3:24:27

great and next is Memorial Hall and wait till you start fixing the roof on the

3:24:33

building you’re in now I see some of the slates moving already I mean these things have to be planned out and money

3:24:39

set aside we need funded we need employees and we need funded

3:24:45

thank you that’s all I’m gonna say thank you Mr quintal any other discussion

3:24:51

Mr Helm I agree with Mr quintal

3:24:56

um I think that he’s right about the nature of of how this town has proceeded

3:25:02

with building projects in the past Patchwork is a very interesting and I

3:25:08

think apropos word to use my concern with this project is and this

3:25:16

you know this coexists side by side in my mind with support and understanding

3:25:24

of what the pilgrim Hall Museum is and represents and its importance to this town

3:25:29

um I think that what Mr quintal

3:25:35

is saying is something that I’ve been saying all of our departments all of our

3:25:41

institutions all of the all of the aspects of our town that ask for

3:25:49

taxpayer money which this is an example need to sharpen themselves they need to

3:25:55

get out of 30 40 400 years ago and start thinking about what is really going on

3:26:02

around them and I I you know Donna and I are going to totally disagree on this

3:26:08

but I think that this roof was clearly from the pictures that I’ve seen it’s been a problem for a little while

3:26:14

certainly a number of years where fundraising could have begun in Earnest but instead it was not and now the

3:26:22

taxpayers of Plymouth are being asked to pay for it I’m not saying that it’s you

3:26:29

know it’s something surprising that the taxpayers of Plymouth are being asked to

3:26:35

pay for it it’s in fact very common that the taxpayers of Plymouth are asked to

3:26:41

pay for the fact that our administration of all sorts of projects has been faulty

3:26:48

over time and that even the best of our procedures are informed by 400 years of

3:26:55

procedures that don’t meet up with the expectations of the year 2000 and and

3:27:02

Beyond and we need to get there and I I

3:27:08

personally question if this is about a roof

3:27:14

replacement which it does say that the project name is the pilgrim Hall Museum

3:27:20

roof Skylight project that it should focus on the roof and Skylight now I

3:27:26

understand Lynn saying that it The Architects are going to look at it holistically but I’m looking at it as a

3:27:32

resident or as a representative of the taxpayers of Plymouth and I’m going to

3:27:38

vote no on this not because I don’t believe that they need a new roof and I don’t believe that it’s not desperate

3:27:43

but I at some point the taxpayers of Plymouth have to stop footing the bill

3:27:50

for the mistakes that are made and this is a time for that to begin happening

3:27:58

thank you Mr Helm any other discussion from any other members of the board

3:28:05

seeing none I will add that I agree with Mr quintal particularly in relation to

3:28:10

our need to focus on facilities maintenance as a community I don’t like

3:28:16

the price tag I have some questions about some of the items being included in it I understand the presentation that

3:28:23

was given but given the price tag I have some concerns about that nevertheless this is a core part of plymouth’s

3:28:30

identity these are some Priceless things that if we were to lose them we’d never be able to get them back so despite mine

3:28:37

not being in love with all aspects of it and certainly not with the price tag uh

3:28:42

I am going to vote in favor of it but that that’s all I’ll say I won’t belabor the point any other discussion from any

3:28:49

other members of the board hearing and seeing none I will call for the vote this was a vote as to whether

3:28:55

or not we recommend town meeting approve article 9d Mr bletzer how do you vote I vote yes thank you Mr Helm no

3:29:04

Mr Mahoney yes Mr quintal yeah and myself yes

3:29:11

so in a vote of four in favor one in opposition and no abstentions we will recommend town meeting approve article

3:29:17

9d so before we go to the next article I will point out that according to the

3:29:25

policies and procedures of the board of Selectmen as adopted on January 17 1995

3:29:31

over 28 years ago if a meeting has not yet concluded the board shall adjourn meetings automatically at 11 PM and no

3:29:38

additional business can be brought up after that time a motion is required to continue beyond that time and only to

3:29:46

conclude the item being discussed so I say that because in the last two hours

3:29:51

we’ve covered four CPC articles and we have five left to go

3:29:57

so we might want to I think it’s going to start to accelerate pick up the pace a little bit I think it may but I’d

3:30:04

rather not rather than making this announcement at 10 56 I figured 956 was

3:30:10

a more fair way to do it so just be aware of that going forward that is the procedural rules with that in mind Mr

3:30:16

Cohan you have the floor okay thank you very much article 9 e is a

3:30:23

recommendation by the community preservation committee it’s an open space um request

3:30:29

see people exiting I let people exit so I don’t get distracted easily distracted

3:30:36

okay so it’s an open space recommendation it’s really centered around well protection the property is

3:30:44

owned by a local family that’s been cranberry growing in this vicinity they entered into an agreement with the

3:30:50

United States Department of Agriculture they went after a

3:30:55

a grant program that buys up agricultural rights and bogs on Water

3:31:02

Resources so the family that um that owned the property uh entered into

3:31:10

an agreement with their agricultural rights were purchased away we had the property appraised and the remaining

3:31:17

interests on the property the remaining interest was came in at about two hundred and ten thousand dollars uh the

3:31:23

appraisal uh for the 50.2 acres of land of bogs and Uplands around Rocky Pond

3:31:29

Road the owners of the property have agreed to a bargain sale of 175 thousand

3:31:36

dollars um and again uh as I indicated before this acquisition is about protecting a

3:31:43

water well a well-town well in water protection in this vicinity uh the office of marine environmental Affairs

3:31:50

has been working with this family for a number of years a number of families in this vicinity protecting the Water

3:31:55

Resource for the town of Plymouth obviously this area is ecologically

3:32:01

significant it includes coastal plain Pond vernal pools core habitat rare

3:32:07

species that are adjacent to a priority rare species habitat so the area itself

3:32:14

is significant Beyond just the water protection but the other attributes

3:32:19

environmentally are critical in protecting this this area which is an

3:32:25

act which is a water core buffer area to our town water supply it abuts nearly also not only does this acquisition

3:32:33

encumber the the pond grassy pond in the well but it also butts an additional 67

3:32:40

acres of land that is owned by the town of Plymouth so we’re expanding on what

3:32:46

has been taking place in this area with the coordination with the town of Plymouth and its office of marine

3:32:52

environmental Affairs uh bringing forth opportunities of water protection and

3:32:57

habitat protection in this vicinity here we are where the

3:33:04

the property is located you can see right here outlined

3:33:11

is the property that we’re speaking of this is a great cell Pond right here and

3:33:17

low Pond is over here this is Billington C coming down this

3:33:23

way and this is uh heading out to the town to the state forest so you can see

3:33:29

in this vicinity there’s quite a bit of Conservation Area that has been amassed through the Commonwealth of

3:33:35

Massachusetts and the town of Plymouth protecting these Water Resources in this

3:33:41

area so you can see another slide here we go in and you can see little grassy Pond

3:33:48

there not a big pond but it’s right there

3:33:53

uh and that’s the the pawn that I was talking about in the Water Resources these are the Cranberry Bogs that were

3:33:59

operating in the area obviously having a great effect on little cell Pond uh uh

3:34:05

which is in the middle of our town Forest next to great South pond so obviously taking these Cranberry Bogs

3:34:10

out of production um is a good thing because obviously the fertilizing and all the other chemicals

3:34:17

associated with Pest Control when growing cranberries would be taken from

3:34:22

the water supply so again it’s about water protection habitat protection about building on conservation land it’s

3:34:29

at 175 thousand dollars and we hope that you support this article for fall town

3:34:34

meeting thank you thank you Mr Cohan any questions from

3:34:39

any members of the board okay Mr quintal

3:34:47

Bill I just have one question when you do this piece of property it would be uh

3:34:55

water or any utility uh you know beer jug say 20 years from now 10 years from

3:35:02

now um so we probably would have the engineering department look at it uh Sid

3:35:09

cash he used to look at a lot of these uh requests to make sure that uh the

3:35:14

land that was falling into conservation where there was a road passing through it that there would be uh some

3:35:20

accommodation for possible future drainage is that what you’re speaking of North Green is like if we we had a well

3:35:27

while we’re trying to throw another um

3:35:32

I just want to make sure that Tom meaton’s aware that these conservation restrictions leave it open to the Future

3:35:40

just like utilities uh absolute needs of the community not for any building

3:35:46

purposes or anything like that we can check if we had to run a lot of

3:35:53

fire through there could we do it I’d have to get a clarification my understanding is that when you use

3:35:59

Community preservation funds for the purpose of protection of the land uh a

3:36:05

certain level of development would not be allowable but I can check and to see

3:36:10

if uh utility easement is is something that a utility activity bringing water

3:36:17

or electricity to the area I can check for clarification on that for you to bring dizzy do you have anything you

3:36:24

could add in relation to that nothing to add other than

3:36:31

I agree with the Mr quintal that having the ability to have utility

3:36:39

easements or donut hole properties which have been done in the past for for a water source would be extremely

3:36:47

important as we continue to put conservation restrictions on hundreds

3:36:53

and hundreds of Acres on the land in town I don’t think you can have a utility

3:36:59

easement no I I think that it’s important to note that the monies that have been set aside

3:37:07

by the residents of Plymouth for open space protection open space protection so development of these sites and in

3:37:13

these manners would not be allowed right but presumably presumably the residents also want to be able to get potable

3:37:20

water yes in that and then this money is designed to protect the Water Resource

3:37:25

now if the town wanted to build a well they would have to find those

3:37:31

funding sources and invest in the land in in the well that would be a separate

3:37:37

use of the fund Mr Mahoney something to add or a question yeah I

3:37:44

agree with Mr quintal and Mr brindisi we have to be more strategic with respect to Donut hauling our ability to put in

3:37:51

infrastructure but on this one we’re not talking about constructing a well the example I heard from Mr quintal was you

3:37:58

know and I agree what if this is well somewhere else just getting it from point A to point B right

3:38:03

I’d be happy if we if we just had the permission to you know run a pipe through there so I toured this problem

3:38:11

I I I’d have that I’d have the um manager as the department had Mr Gould

3:38:19

about how that’s going to work so I toured the property with Mr brindisi and Mr Gould his intention is this is

3:38:26

protecting your existing water resources and he’s in he already I believe has money lined up

3:38:33

um for a restoration the intention is to do a Wetlands restoration there is a

3:38:38

small amount of infrastructure left in the property he already knows about that and his intention to take care of it but

3:38:43

I would have the Tom manager follow up with Mr Gould about asking that question

3:38:49

okay I mean we’re voting on it tonight so getting a follow-up is nice and all but

3:38:55

we have we have decision this evening about this I can provide some clarification on that that if

3:39:01

um when you place a conservation restriction on the land you’re not going to be able to dig it up and put a pipe

3:39:08

through it so I I you know we can get some further clarification my understanding of the conservation

3:39:13

restrictions that were required to put because of the use of the CPA fund requires a level of protection that

3:39:19

might make that process difficult but we can always seek the clarification but I

3:39:25

know that this money is set aside for preservation and in the past restrictions of the allowable activities

3:39:30

that may not be allowable okay any other questions from any other

3:39:35

members of the board hearing and seeing none do I have a

3:39:41

motion to recommend tell meeting approve article 9 eat will approval Mr Mahoney

3:39:46

has moved do I have a second

3:39:52

Mr Canty will second since the procedural rules also allow the chair to make motions in second uh so it has been

3:39:59

moved it has been seconded any discussion from any members of the board about whether or not we should recommend timing to improve article 9e Mr Mahoney

3:40:07

so I understand the concern and we have to do a better job moving forward

3:40:12

identifying these opportunities to you know the term was donut holes you

3:40:19

know these uh the ability to put an infrastructure out even if that doesn’t exist on this property I still suggest

3:40:25

uh support this purchase but I would again I request that town manager reach

3:40:31

out to the department head and ask if if it is possible A and B would that

3:40:38

still um in the futuristic our ability to you know get water from wherever the well is

3:40:44

cited out there to another section of the community you know by going uh you know circumventing the uh said 50 acres

3:40:53

thank you Mr Mahoney any other discussion Mr hell I agree with Mr Mahoney

3:41:00

um given that um land is increasingly in short supply

3:41:07

it does mean we are reaching a point where we need to know the answer to that

3:41:13

question when we are considering these articles not for future at some point I’ll update

3:41:21

you before town meeting after we’ve already approved it we need to know beforehand so we need to know what those

3:41:27

rules and regulations are around what can or cannot happen on conservation

3:41:32

land so I’m echoing what Mr Mahoney said any other discussion from any other

3:41:39

members of the board hearing and seeing none

3:41:45

I will call for the vote once again alphabetically through the role Mr bletzer how do you vote

3:41:52

yes Mr Helm yes Mr Mahoney yes Mr quintal

3:42:00

no [Music] thank you and myself no that brings us to article 9 F Mr Cohan

3:42:08

article 9f is a recommendation to acquire uh 23.6 Acres more or less off

3:42:15

of Rocky Hill Road the applicant or the owner of the property is manamed Inc they’re a science research facility in

3:42:21

manomet formerly known as the manomet bird Observatory now known as Main Event Hank an international organization that

3:42:29

tracks migrating species up and down the Eastern Seaboard

3:42:34

and through Plymouth so the 23 acres has nearly 400 feet of Frontage on Plymouth

3:42:40

Bay off of Rocky Hill Road it contains three distinct areas of landscape you

3:42:45

have a maritime Forest which is unique you have wetlands and vernal pools on the property an extensive Frontage on

3:42:52

Cape Cod Bay which is obviously a whole different habitat along the coastal

3:42:58

Bluff area and the beach itself it’s designated as ecologically significant

3:43:03

in terms of the coastal natural Community Systems that are supported by this this Coastal forest and the Marine

3:43:11

shrubs that that are in this area that allow this migrating activity to take

3:43:18

place through this location and it is uh it is not only a form of

3:43:25

habitat protection in open space protection but it’s also uh a place

3:43:32

where we could have passive recreational activities passive recreational activities that would be have a parking Trailhead we would be developing areas

3:43:40

for hiking trails so that people can hike out to the peninsula over this property because it is kind of the the

3:43:47

point uh this Rocky Hill Pine Hills area as you can see is kind

3:43:54

of the pit Point peninsula of of the Pine Hills and Rocky

3:44:02

Point it sticks out right here this is Rocky Hill Road and this is the area that we’re looking

3:44:10

at preserving was originally owned by a family called the sales family who donated their land to the manomet

3:44:17

Inc which is the science research facility they own this land and they can

3:44:24

dispense of it how they will they approach the CPC we had it appraised it

3:44:29

appraised for or one million two hundred thousand dollars this request is for one

3:44:35

million two hundred and ten thousand dollars there was a small building well it was a residential home on this site

3:44:40

that Management Inc had to go through the permitting process to take the building down so all the asbestos all

3:44:47

the lead all the testing that was associated with this building was conducted uh by uh the current owner and

3:44:55

has been completed to the satisfaction of the permitting agencies relevant to the dis the demolition of this building

3:45:02

it does remain a cement slab in a remnant of a chimney that’s why the

3:45:08

article does include an additional ten thousand uh if it is the desire for the town to take down this chimney that was

3:45:16

part of this home in this slab it was left there by the current owner with the thought that they would build a pavilion

3:45:22

and underneath it that have educational opportunities it was one of the things that they were talking about so they

3:45:27

didn’t do small they did they didn’t just demolish the entire higher structure is still a remnant of the

3:45:34

structure left uh there you can see kind of Plymouth Bay to the north and Rocky Hill to the West

3:45:42

Milwaukee Hill Road and the property itself there’ll be a small turn off where you would come off the road and

3:45:48

you could pull off for a few cars to turn around safely and then exit the property it’s something that David Gould

3:45:53

has looked into with Management Inc they’ve looked at the site checking the sight lines and the committee would work

3:46:00

with that office in in creating signage and an area where you can pull off

3:46:06

there’s currently a road that takes you all the way back to where this house was

3:46:11

that would be gated because we wouldn’t want people to go deep into the property we would keep people right up on Rocky

3:46:19

Hill Road so when you passed by the property you could look and see where

3:46:25

who was on the property or not we found that’s very important for safety issues

3:46:30

to know that there’s no one deep onto the property with a vehicle so it would be gated and we would utilize the existing trails

3:46:38

to the area there are some nice obviously there’s the driveway that takes you out to this location where you

3:46:44

have a Vista a view of the bay um and then there are some existing

3:46:50

Trails for this area here the butter to the um to the direct South is the power

3:46:56

plant so that’s the direct budget to the South uh to the West here we have the

3:47:02

1500 Acres that stretch West obviously there is a great deal of forested area

3:47:08

to the west of this property this property by protecting this area and its

3:47:15

habitat does create a wildlife card from the ocean to the back forest and Uplands

3:47:21

so there’s a lot of different reasons why we’d want to preserve something like this not only for the

3:47:26

the opportunity for the residents of Plymouth to take advantage of waterfront property there’s not a lot of waterfront

3:47:32

property left in this town for people to to go and visit if anybody went to

3:47:38

Plymouth Beach this Labor Day weekend it was very difficult to get on the beach and and it’s

3:47:43

Waterfront access for its residents is is a very difficult task so anytime we

3:47:51

have an opportunity where we can protective preserve or open up a a

3:47:59

possible land this area of Rocky Hill is quite Rocky so it’s not really a place

3:48:04

that you would go down and swim or recreate on a beach it’s a very cobbly Rocky

3:48:10

Bluff area we wouldn’t be advocating any stairs to the beach or any infrastructure of the beach it really is

3:48:17

just a Scenic Overlook for Passive recreational use and that concludes our presentation on

3:48:24

article 9f all right any questions Mr Mahoney

3:48:30

bill you are 100 correct the community does a poor job

3:48:35

of providing quality Waterfront access so whenever we can secure that whether it be fresh water or

3:48:42

the ocean we need to make a move and that’s one of the reasons I support this article but having said that so your slides

3:48:48

say that there’s 400 foot of Frontage in the packet on 174 it says is 500 foot

3:48:56

in the frontage and I swear to God when we first started discussing this as a committee this potential purchase it was

3:49:03

initially rolled out of as eight to nine hundred foot of ocean Frontage so seeing three

3:49:10

different numbers here and um wait so where do these statistics

3:49:16

come from uh they come from the maps that were provided uh by the applicant

3:49:22

um their the uh the maps that are displayed on pages

3:49:32

um and any anyways 167 and 166. come on once

3:49:38

what are you talking about Pages now Pages yeah so look at 174 right project

3:49:43

summary yep second sentence second um paragraph 500 foot of Frontage so you

3:49:49

tell me to go back to what 164. 167. oh wait hey yeah it’s 167. let me just

3:49:55

make sure that it’s the right page it doesn’t look good hang on

3:50:04

anyways it’s not going to deter me from supporting this um the other thing is the committee took

3:50:11

a different tact on this one the purchase price is 1.2 million we included ten thousand dollars for the

3:50:18

potential removal of existing infrastructure your department head has made a site visit he has advised me that

3:50:25

the 10 000 is more than sufficient for the removal of any existing infrastructure chimney Etc and this is a

3:50:32

philosophy that the finance director would love to see the committee continue to embrace moving forward

3:50:38

oh and the other thing I’d like to you know I know you want to hear this under discussion but I sure do yeah but you’re

3:50:44

going to say now all right okay thank you Mr bletzer any questions yeah we

3:50:49

have a couple so Bill he said there’s access to the uh to the you I mean you can walk down to

3:50:56

the water uh no so there’s the water it’s not all woods so when you get out

3:51:02

to this point uh excuse me when you get out to this location here which would there’s a

3:51:08

natural trail that takes you to this location where the former residence was you can see uh through the the lower

3:51:15

canopy you can see the ocean at a distance we’re not advocating building

3:51:20

any infrastructure to the beach uh there’s a rough Cliff that takes you down and then a very Rocky Beach there

3:51:27

so we’re not advocating now we’re we’re advocating people visiting the property hiking the property and then looking on

3:51:34

over this uh over this banking in this Bluff out to sea so it’s a Scenic Vista

3:51:40

that we’re you know advocating can this land be developed uh yes it could be

3:51:46

developed yet it could be developed because it was appraised on based on its uh development capability correct I mean that’s a prime

3:51:54

uh it’s Prime Property I understand open space and you want access to the beach but that doesn’t

3:52:00

look like uh access to the beach well we’re we’re advocating the ability

3:52:07

how high is that by the way uh I don’t know the exact measurement of the bluff but in this vicinity it’s it’s more than

3:52:13

40 feet uh 40 feet up uh but it’s all rocks I’m pretty familiar with correct

3:52:21

it’s it’s very Rocky very Rocky Coast High Bluff area it wouldn’t be uh cost

3:52:26

Pro efficient to cost prohibitive to put a staircase down to the water there due

3:52:31

to the storm and the weather conditions we would lose those stairs by the time you got down to the water you’d be kind

3:52:37

of climbing over rocks so one of the things that we were advocating here is that not all waterfront property would

3:52:44

be the the easiest water to to get to this was about going to a property that was undeveloped and looking out to the

3:52:50

ocean the scenic Vistas and the hiking and the passive recreational capability this is different from Plymouth Beach or

3:52:57

some other published so you’re talking about walk-in Trails access to get there I mean that’s

3:53:06

you go past the power plant and that you know that’s is there a macro to even get

3:53:13

in and there’s money you get packing for a few gas uh yes so uh similar to other

3:53:18

preserves you have Trail heads and the trailheads have a limited number of uh

3:53:23

parking capability obviously this isn’t a situation like Plymouth Beach uh where

3:53:28

you have a Big Sandy Beach and it’s easy to get to when you’re attracting hundreds of visitors this is more of a

3:53:34

passive recreational area where a few cars would pull off people will hike out look out at the sea look at this area

3:53:40

undisturbed that is similar to a number of the conservation Parcels of land in

3:53:46

the town of Plymouth where we have a Trailhead that carries maybe three to four to five to six cars Senate Hill

3:53:53

preserve is a pretty active place this weekend it never reached its full

3:53:58

capacity we have two Trail heads there with a total of 12 parking spaces but at no point did that site become over

3:54:06

during this Labor Day weekend with that beach you can actually hike and sit on the beach and you can get into the water

3:54:12

there so some of these places are a little bit different where they’re hiking in and Hiking out it kind of

3:54:17

limits the attraction to some people but other people enjoy the hiking experience and looking out at the ocean and that’s

3:54:24

that is what the property offers and again chairman quinto’s question about

3:54:29

utilities access utilities that’s it’s still I

3:54:35

believe is there a is there a well potential wealth site

3:54:41

there um I I do not know where the potential well sites are in this vicinity that’s something the town would have to

3:54:47

research I know that your town manager is going to look in with Council about uh development capability of the land

3:54:54

but I can tell you that the the purpose of this community preservation Fund in its requirement of a conservation

3:55:00

restriction is for that to to conserve the land and protect the land in this case it is a passive recreational area

3:55:07

protecting habitat of migrating species and Coastal and Coastal area but also

3:55:13

giving the residents the ability to hike in and look out at the sea

3:55:18

any other questions from any other members of the board here okay Mr Helm

3:55:26

um bill just real quickly you mentioned um the turnaround the parking area at

3:55:33

Rocky Hill Road how big do you envision that to be how many cars do you envision

3:55:38

um allowing um so um I leave that to town staff to

3:55:44

determine uh how they want to pursue that the committee stands by and in any

3:55:49

way to help with its use of its administrative fund to help develop a parking Trailhead this is what we’ve

3:55:55

been doing for 21 years around the town of Plymouth working with staff and developing trailheads and so did signage

3:56:01

did you speak to David golden okay what did David think David Gould had a chance to go

3:56:07

down to the property and look at it he thought it was adequate where he could get vehicles in safely and turn around

3:56:14

and leave so that there’s no at all any backing up at this location okay but but no idea about how many cars and

3:56:21

therefore how many people would be able to use it at any given time I think the discussion was centered around maybe

3:56:26

four or five parking spaces okay thank you any other questions from any other

3:56:32

members of the committee seeing none do I have a motion to

3:56:39

recommend time meeting approve article 9f motion Mr Helm has moved do I have a

3:56:44

second Mr Mahoney has seconded has been moved and seconded any discussion from any

3:56:51

members of the committee Mr Mahoney all right so

3:56:58

holtec International controls 1675 Acres still in the community

3:57:04

obviously they’re in the process of decommissioning a power plant that sits on a campus of 133 Acres

3:57:10

south of that highlighted area there so strategically

3:57:16

it is a benefit for this community to have a foothold down there adjacent to

3:57:21

them um what I bet on the community

3:57:26

of Plymouth of getting control eventually of the 133 acre campus site I wouldn’t bet on that but I also wouldn’t

3:57:33

bet against it so obviously recently we’ve been in negotiations with the plant on a pilot program

3:57:41

I will tell you that we’re an executive on I believe Tuesday

3:57:46

August 8th which I believe the day that is the day that Mr brindisi and Mr Canty

3:57:52

Zoomed In from Japan at six or seven a.m prior to getting on the bus to head to

3:57:58

Tokyo for the plane ride back so after you two hung up your remote

3:58:05

participation Mr Gould was an executive with us and didn’t outline a map and the

3:58:12

theory of you know if x amount of certain Acres of the 1543 become a

3:58:18

conservation you’re trying to build a you know some of it might end up in open

3:58:24

space and Recreation and some of it might be developed for economic development but he did show a map where

3:58:30

it was the intention of getting people from the State Forest

3:58:35

through Trail systems to come out on the Atlantic Ocean on that site so that is definitely a benefit to this

3:58:43

one here thank you Mr Mahoney

3:58:49

any other uh discussion from any other members of the board at this time

3:58:57

hearing and seeing none I will call for the vote once again alphabetically through the role yes no or abstain when

3:59:03

I reach your name Mr bletzer how do you vote I’m going to vote no on this thank you

3:59:10

Mr Helm yes Mr Mahoney yes and Mr quintal

3:59:16

yeah and myself yes so this is a vote of four

3:59:22

in favor one in opposition so article 9f passes did not announce Article 90

3:59:28

earlier due to the hour but that 90 did get a three to two vote and will also be

3:59:36

recommended that brings us to article 9 G the community preservation act

3:59:43

recreational Hedges Pond demolition article Mr Cohan

3:59:49

uh thank you very much uh article 9g is a recommendation the applicant is the

3:59:55

town of Plymouth looking they’ve been doing testing at Hedges Pond the CPC did set aside fifteen thousand dollars of

4:00:01

its administrative fund so the town could do testing to determine uh what buildings were testing poverty positive

4:00:08

for asbestos and Lead it is the decision of the Town based on this testing

4:00:14

activity that they want to remove some cabins and some other buildings on the

4:00:19

on the site there was some cost estimates that were provided in the application that is attached to your

4:00:25

briefing material the recommendation is for 157 500 for the demolition of this

4:00:32

infrastructure at Hedges pond I prepared to take your questions if you

4:00:37

have any all right do we have any from the board from Mr Khan Mr helm

4:00:44

um I noticed in some of the material it mentions um a handful of

4:00:51

um like 10 by 16 reads fairy sheds

4:00:56

did I read that correctly say that a 10 by 16 10 by 16 or something or other

4:01:01

I’ll have to look for it but mention some reads fairy sheds meat fairy sheds

4:01:08

um I know that uh The Sheds that exist on the site were constructed around the 1930s and 40s no no no I I understand I

4:01:16

understand that give me give me a minute page 165 with Reed’s Ferry sheds pricing

4:01:22

is with removed Windows may move door to any wall 165 contains a reference to an item

4:01:30

Reed’s Ferry sheds I’m not sure of the reference of it we

4:01:37

have a number of small sheds that have tested positive at the site the

4:01:43

inventory of buildings on the site obviously is the Great Hall the Great

4:01:48

Hall is joined by a Boathouse down by the water in a small cabin down by the

4:01:53

water and then there is two Lodge duplexes built in the 1990 they were not

4:01:59

testing as problematic there are five small sheds in an area

4:02:06

just south of the property I think those are the sheds that you’re referencing Mr

4:02:11

Helms the the five sheds that existed in that vicinity

4:02:17

um actually let me read it says reads fairy sheds pricing is with removed

4:02:23

Windows slash may move door to any wall roof gam gambrel it says gamble but that

4:02:30

meant gambrel parentheses material Cedar tongue and then there’s a 10 by 12 or 9

4:02:38

000 a 10 by 16 for 11 000 a 12 by 16 for 12 500 and a 14 by 16

4:02:47

for 14 000 and then it oddly it says underneath cost fifteen thousand so

4:02:55

I’m not sure exactly what this means so I know I know that uh that uh when David

4:03:00

was working on the testing of the buildings at this location they were the cabins but there were also some

4:03:07

buildings that fit the description that were uh pump houses and wellhouses uh

4:03:12

that were in the same vicinity uh that had to come down also so there was a series of cabins there was a couple of

4:03:18

uh there was a bathroom that was no longer in use that was dysfunctional in

4:03:24

a pump house in some cabins so that’s the inventory of the buildings that are being tested and suggested from the

4:03:31

removal well to Mr Helm’s question there’s other

4:03:38

items environmental building pump buildings cabins out back that all list

4:03:43

demo buildings underneath them and then Reeds Ferry sheds it’s unclear if you’re

4:03:48

demoing or you’re buying a shed because it looks like you’re pricing the purchase of a Reeds Ferry shed there

4:03:55

none of which lines up with the fifteen thousand dollar price tag that’s listed

4:04:00

but nevertheless it looks like a shed is being purchased not demolished yeah so

4:04:05

uh we’re not um we’re not this money is not being put in place for purchasing any sheds it’s

4:04:11

for demolition these estimates that have been prepared by the department of marine Valley montess might have been

4:04:17

asking for other accommodations but the 157 500 was the number that was given to

4:04:23

us by the applicant for the purpose of uh demolition so the 150s

4:04:29

Mr bletzer do you have a question I’m getting tired Phil I’m sorry so the 157

4:04:37

it’s to demo how many sheds um there’s approximately four cabins

4:04:45

that need to come down uh there is an abandoned bathroom that’s never been in

4:04:50

use that’s been boarded up along with a an old well pump house so between the four cabins

4:04:57

um uh one two three four five cabins a banded bathroom and pump house that

4:05:03

brings you to seven and then there’s a small cabin Down By The Boathouse and that brings it to I think around eight

4:05:10

structures varying size from 15 to 16 by

4:05:15

10 by 16. so I see demo building environmental building that’s ten

4:05:21

thousand here we adding this up yeah and then demo building 7 500.

4:05:29

yep and then the cabins out back 25 000 which how many of them are there

4:05:36

they just five it’s for all yeah yeah so that’s 25 000 total or twenty five

4:05:43

thousand twenty five thousand no total for cabins out back it should be total and that just FYI Mr Blitzer that brings

4:05:51

the total cost to that point of this list of forty two thousand five hundred

4:05:56

dollars so now if you have the fifteen thousand that says fifty seven five

4:06:07

uh no this uh we’re not proposing that so it should be 42 and 9505.

4:06:15

right um we were putting the money in play for the demolition that was recommended by

4:06:21

Dave’s office and Dave Gould and um so that was the number that we were staying to but uh the action of town meeting

4:06:27

wouldn’t allow us to buy any so how much you were asking for it I’m asking for what Dave Gould has filed with the

4:06:34

committee in the town has filed with the committee which is 157 500.

4:06:39

so but that followed go ahead so where’s it is 150 115

4:06:47

000 difference from what it costs the demo of the buildings

4:06:59

the issue though is the other demo buildings add up to 42.5 right and then

4:07:04

it’s unclear what what this reads Ferry sheds is whether we’re it looks like we’re buying a from now it’s

4:07:10

presented I I would have to say that we are because you add fifteen thousand so

4:07:15

obviously these four concepts are Concepts that they’ve costed out and

4:07:21

they’re saying the cost of the reads Ferry shed wherever that’s going to be is going to be 15 000 probably because

4:07:28

they want to put it on a pad or something so they are adding to come to the 57.5 of the basic costs and then if

4:07:37

it with a passing tclp test and if it fails it’s a hundred and fifty seven

4:07:42

thousand five hundred so there is a fifteen thousand dollar shed purchase

4:07:48

okay being added in here okay so um uh the article language is for demolition

4:07:54

so we wouldn’t be buying any infrastructure now applications might indicate uh different scenarios within

4:08:02

their application and you see what we have received but the committee did not

4:08:07

take up a discussion about buying a shed the only discussions that were held at

4:08:13

that time were about demolition based on the Asbestos and lead testing that was being conducted by the town so it was

4:08:19

setting aside in the article for Demolition and not the acquisition of anything Mr Hall a question well yeah

4:08:26

because I’m reading the article language and it says to see if the town will vote to appropriate the fiscal year 2020 blah

4:08:34

blah blah estimated revenues community community preservation reserves or other available funds the sum of 157 500.

4:08:43

and I think it’s pretty clear that in that 157 500 is fifteen thousand dollars

4:08:51

for a shed so yeah you’re you’re asking you know for 157.5 for the demolitions

4:08:58

of buildings you are correct you are asking for demolition of buildings but that cost okay and it does mention by

4:09:05

the way um including all incidental and related costs

4:09:10

and my I guess the question that I have is that fifteen thousand dollars in

4:09:16

incidental cost that um maybe David is planning on right maybe the person in the audience with

4:09:23

his hand up may know can we have him if you ask a question of

4:09:28

someone in the audience they could answer it well I’m wondering what Mr Leiden may know about this

4:09:36

Steve line the only thing I can think of is replacing uh the shed where the guy

4:09:41

sits to collect the uh to freeze the park there that’s the only place I could see to put a reach head in

4:09:51

that building was built in 2017. excuse me 2015 and obviously there

4:09:59

was no asbestos or lead and that building isn’t being tested what about the environmental building excuse me

4:10:06

the environmental building um well there was some there was some buildings that we determined and we

4:10:12

called them the environmental you know those buildings uh from the 40s and 50s

4:10:17

um you know typically when bills come in for paying for an article related to an

4:10:23

action of town meeting the finance director would look at it in terms of the spirit of of what is being presented

4:10:29

to the department and what the article is reserved for right now it’s reserved for demolition

4:10:35

um so that’s what we’re funding

4:10:42

okay any other questions from any other members of the board

4:10:51

all right do I have a motion to recommend Tim meeting approve article 9g

4:10:56

Mr Mahoney has moved Mr bletzer has seconded any discussion

4:11:03

Mr Mahoney so my understanding of this article was

4:11:09

that it had a ceiling of 157 it potentially had a floor of around 60 or 70 grand

4:11:15

it’s a lot of play in there with respect to the testing the lead what the the ability of the dmaea to uh

4:11:23

you know the Tipping fee of the disposal cost of this so I would just request through the town

4:11:29

manager that you know maybe we can get a little synopsis from David you know what’s going on here and then solve the

4:11:35

uh the case of the uh imaginary shed

4:11:41

all right any other discussion from any other members of the board I’m Mr hell sorry uh it has gottenly

4:11:49

um I am going to vote Yes on this even though there is a fifteen thousand dollar shed floating around somewhere on

4:11:56

that property um in the hopes that prior to town meeting Bill you’ll run that to ground

4:12:02

and find out what it is okay any other discussion from any other

4:12:09

members of the board all right

4:12:16

hearing and seeing none I will call for the vote alphabetically through the role yes no or abstain when I reach your name

4:12:21

Mr Blitzer has Expo thank you Mr Helm yes Mr Mahoney yes Mr quintal it appears

4:12:30

he’s not on Zoom at the moment the quintal is absolutely all right and uh myself no

4:12:39

that brings us to article 9 h

4:12:51

can you please put your microphone on sorry about that article 9 H is a

4:12:57

article recommended by the community preservation committee to reduce the borrowing from The Originals uh

4:13:02

stevensfield article as you know back in 2015 we dedicated two million dollars

4:13:08

towards the the uh the renovations to Stevens Field that renovation is gone

4:13:14

out to bid uh hopefully uh contracts will be signed sometime this fall and the work will begin in anticipation of

4:13:21

this work approaching very quickly we felt it was important to stop moving available funds at one million four

4:13:28

hundred and eighty seven thousand one hundred fifty four dollars to be available for the construction as

4:13:35

invoices come in for this work that’s going to be done late this year and early into next year this is a strategy

4:13:41

that we often follow at times we’ll go to town meeting we’ll ask for approval to borrow but when we find Opportunities

4:13:47

where we can come in and pay down that borrowing authorization instead lining up money into a fund so that we can pay

4:13:53

as the invoices come in similar to what might have been touched on earlier tonight with the pilgrim Hall article

4:13:59

it’s being presented to Tom meeting uh you know a year before the bills start

4:14:05

could come in that allows the committee to kind of look at how it wants to pay down that borrowing so we avoid

4:14:10

borrowing and save on the cost of borrowing so it’s a strategy the committee has pursued for many years and

4:14:16

here we are tonight with article 9 H Stevensville borrowing reduction article

4:14:22

thank you any questions from any members of the committee

4:14:28

Mr Mahoney Mr chairman chairman is it appropriate now to get

4:14:34

the quick update on the Steven seal project from the town manager will you prefer that under old new business I

4:14:40

would definitely prefer that one any uh any other questions from any

4:14:47

members of the board if no one else does uh bill

4:14:54

so recently we put money arpa money towards Stevens Field

4:15:03

um that’s Town money that went into that and I know when uh this article was being discussed some time ago there was

4:15:10

conversations about how CPC money is not supposed to be used

4:15:15

to offset the operating budget of the town and yet the town is putting money in

4:15:23

towards a CPC article with the arpa fund so I understand not wanting to borrow and pay with cash on hand but in the

4:15:32

discussion when this cost overrun was there and you’re going to have an article related to Stevens Field was

4:15:38

there any consideration of upping your contribution not just paying down

4:15:44

borrowing so that the arpa funds wouldn’t need to be paid towards that because the arpa funds could go to a

4:15:49

number of other things that the town needs could you uh respond to that

4:16:03

sorry getting late in the year 2015 the CPC put together a nautical Italian meeting

4:16:09

for two million dolls but we also in the year 2000 in uh

4:16:15

um year 2000 and 20

4:16:20

22 the spring of 22 we went to town meeting and we made a recommendation

4:16:26

for another additional 2 million dollars to complete the Stevensville so we did up we noticed what we had in 2015 didn’t

4:16:34

suffice we went back in the year 2022 and we upped another two million dollars

4:16:41

now that did not go out to bid until July of 23. so when we were putting

4:16:48

money aside in 22 that was nearly almost 14 15 months ago so the time it took for

4:16:54

Tom meeting to put the money in play and for the bid to go out obviously we went through a pretty tough time in terms of

4:17:01

inflation the town’s ability to get a bid out is critical in this economic

4:17:07

climate to get the best estimates that we possibly can the longer it takes us to get bids out the costs go up I think

4:17:16

that the CPC recognized is the difficult time that we’re in in terms of getting bids out but the CPC over a period of

4:17:23

time has committed a great deal of fun to this the time that when the bids came in

4:17:30

though the time had elapsed for the

4:17:35

the committee felt it was uh uh you know a Cooperative gesture by the

4:17:42

select boy to offer some Opera money to make sure that there was enough money to

4:17:48

cover the estimates that were coming in for the construction on Stevens Field so

4:17:53

um you know the town stepped up to the plate with Opera money the CPC over period of time has been committing a

4:18:00

significant amount of funds to stevensfield we always like to see uh you know the applicant

4:18:06

participate in a manner which matches the CPC funds significantly so this was just an

4:18:14

example of the the commitment that the town has for this project in partnering with the CPC to get the project done but

4:18:22

there’s a lot of moving different parts to it and you know that’s one component of it

4:18:29

okay any other questions from any other members of the board

4:18:35

all right do I have a motion to recommend tell meeting approve article 9h I’ll make the motion Mr bletzer has

4:18:42

moved do I have a second Mr Helm has seconded any discussion from any members of the board

4:18:51

hearing and seeing none I will call for the vote Mr bletzer how

4:18:57

do you vote I vote Yes Mr Hallam yes Mr Mahoney yes

4:19:03

and Anthony Mr quintal is still not on okay if he comes back on let me know but otherwise I’ll move forward

4:19:10

uh and I will vote no so in a vote of three in favor and one

4:19:17

opposed uh article we will recommend article 9 H to town meeting

4:19:23

that brings us to article 9i that’s right sorry one more I had a cope

4:19:29

is a community preservation committee is recommending article 9 I which is our

4:19:35

final article of the evening that’s the administrative account that we set aside Monies to handle the administrative activities of the CPC it’s an

4:19:43

Administration it’s an article that we put forth every year and

4:19:48

that is the recommendation of the committee so if you have any questions on that uh article please let me know

4:19:57

thank you any questions from any members of the board hearing and seeing none do I have

4:20:04

emotion move approval Mr Mahoney has moved second Mr Helm has seconded any

4:20:11

discussion about whether or not we should recommend tell me to prove article 9i Mr Mahoney

4:20:19

so we’re rectifying the masonicles should have came forward in April and what happened was we created for the

4:20:26

first time in 21 years effectively 120 day window with the community the committee is not legally allowed to

4:20:33

spend money so that has to be rectified and this article should for the following fiscal year beyond the docket

4:20:40

in April of next year thank you Mr Mahoney

4:20:46

any other discussion hearing and seeing none I’ll call for the vote Mr bletzer how do you vote I

4:20:52

vote yes thank you Mr Helm yes Mr Mahoney yes and I vote Yes it is

4:20:58

unanimous thank you Mr Kohan for your presentations this evening thank you

4:21:04

all right that brings us into the next part of our agenda everyone’s favorite public comment do we have any members of

4:21:11

the public that wish to comment we have Mr Steve Lyden he’s already spoken that was your fault

4:21:22

[Music]

4:21:32

the CPC money the share that the county gives us we’re losing that too uh so

4:21:38

we’re losing twice they have a budget they should pay for this out of their own budget the second thing is I’d like

4:21:45

to make an announcement it’s a very sad one that Mr Paul hapka 20-year he was a town meeting member for 23

4:21:52

years passed away recently and Paul was a great man did a lot for this town so thank you

4:21:58

thank you Mr Leiden appreciate that any other members of the public wish to give comment

4:22:06

hearing and seeing none we’ll move into the next section which is the town manager’s report

4:22:15

all right I have 11 minutes I do before we hit the 11 o’clock out oh so just a couple quick updates so

4:22:23

this past Saturday the American Cruise Lines came in first third and final pilot trip according to our habermaster

4:22:31

everything went well it was uneventful we actually scale back from having five

4:22:38

escorts on the first trip down to I believe this past trip was just two

4:22:43

escorts so that’s something that we are going to have a meeting on next week we’ll meet

4:22:49

with the harbor Masa the chief of police and lobsterman amongst others to review

4:22:55

the three trips in in hopes that we can develop a long-term agreement with the American Cruise Lines so we certainly

4:23:02

will keep you posted because it’s a sport that has to approve that licensure

4:23:07

to select Mahoney’s early uh question about Stevens Field I signed a contract

4:23:15

today so we’ve executed a contract um we’ve awarded the contract we are

4:23:20

expecting the mobilization to take place sometime the next few weeks hopefully

4:23:25

breaking around by the end of September the community will see some work happening in the next week or two our

4:23:33

DPW is going is going to go ahead and demo the two structures that are on that property within the next two weeks

4:23:39

that’ll prep the site for the contractor to to begin their work

4:23:45

then the boltram project will begin just about two weeks so as you can recall

4:23:50

last uh was it last fall last April I forget

4:23:57

um the town boat ramp project was approved so we’ll redo the boat ramp there’ll be floats that will be

4:24:03

installed there will be piles that will be installed and they will

4:24:09

re-construct the walkway right in front of the um uh the lobster Hut as well so

4:24:15

that’s going to be a great project when that once that is done I want to report only because it

4:24:21

continues to be a problem for the town we’ve had two more resignations from police department so we have a total of

4:24:28

13 vacancies again without PD last year at this time we had both a dozen

4:24:36

vacancies about 18 months ago we had approximately 20 vacancies so as the

4:24:41

chief would say we take one step four and two steps back so it’s something that we’re we will be discussing some

4:24:48

long-term strategies on how to fill our ranks and you know one of those

4:24:53

strategies potentially looking at Civil Service as a way to overcome some of these hurdles

4:25:02

um I wanted to also bring up that the communications oversight of the Charis

4:25:07

um the county on the 911 dispatch Center is um completing uh its course we have

4:25:16

completed the police department’s aspect of the oversight we have a couple more monks of having the fire department

4:25:23

continue to try to provide a little bit more oversight as well but everything is going extremely well with the movement

4:25:29

of the 911 dispatch center from the PD over to the the county sheriff’s office

4:25:34

so we will continue to keep you posted on that we’re expecting hopefully some type of more public conversation about

4:25:41

this with the media hopefully by early October the NB just as a reminder the MBTA

4:25:48

communities uh second Forum will take place next Monday uh September 11th at 6

4:25:55

30 at North High as I mentioned earlier we had a great turnaround at the first meeting so expecting the same for the

4:26:01

second meeting and then I also want to recognize Mr J

4:26:06

Kimball from wood Seafood he offered a very low-cost Lobster bake at the Cal

4:26:11

last week and this is I believe the second in a row that Jay Campbell has

4:26:17

done that so we appreciate everything he he does for the count for the seniors but so it’s important to recognize when

4:26:24

our local businesses step up and support our seniors I just wanted to bring up one last item

4:26:30

last week Mr bletza you brought to my attention um some graffiti above UVA wine bar so

4:26:38

that structure uh above the the wine bar the graffiti will be removed tomorrow

4:26:43

the Community Development Division has engaged a local contract to go ahead and

4:26:50

repaint that structure so that the graffiti is no longer in sight

4:26:55

so pending any questions I think I’ll end there for this evening

4:27:01

any questions for the town manager hearing and seeing none thank you Mr

4:27:07

bendizzi that brings us to select board open discussion anyone have any new business

4:27:12

Mr bletzer actually it’s old business and it’s for the town manager too

4:27:18

Derek do you know we don’t do you know how we’re doing with the uh

4:27:24

uh sidewalk sweeper or scrubber which uh I know the the one that they

4:27:31

tried out was a sweeper that didn’t work well they’re looking for a Scrub but any idea where that stands for that uh no

4:27:38

new progress on the uh sidewalk sweet bus scrubber as you pointed out yeah

4:27:44

they did have something that they was just going to sweep the street but as you know when you look at some of our

4:27:49

sidewalks they’re embedded with grease and dog feces and so we really need to

4:27:56

find a piece of equipment that’s going to scrub that clean it some have some

4:28:01

type of Degreaser and that’s really what they’re looking for so more to come on that and the other issue too is trying

4:28:07

to find one that that piece of equipment but the piece of equipment that’s small

4:28:12

enough to navigate our sidewalks which is the other challenge yes well I just I

4:28:18

want to keep that alive I don’t want you to forget about that so all right thanks

4:28:24

any other any other new business rather Mr Mahoney

4:28:30

try to I will keep this brief but I I’m eliminating everything else I was

4:28:36

bringing up but I want to mention this one thing because it’s that important it was kind of horrified by the news that

4:28:41

we heard out of Brockton over the last week with respect to not only a 14.4 million dollar deficit

4:28:49

but not an FY 24 in their prior fiscal year of 23. so

4:28:55

what’s the statistical probability of something like that happening in Plymouth

4:29:01

I would say that the probability of that happening you can never say never but I

4:29:07

would say it’s probably as close as zero percent as we possibly can be

4:29:13

um we have probably one of the best Finance directors in the state with uh miss Lynn Barrett who heads up our

4:29:18

finances always having a watchful eye on our finances we stole the former School

4:29:25

business manager from the school department sitting to my right and it’s helping watch those finances so again I

4:29:31

think it’s it’s you know we can never say can never happen but I think with the the stewards we have watching the

4:29:39

nickels and dimes for the town of Plymouth and the residence I’m fairly certain that it won’t happen in my tenure yeah so I’ll just leave it um

4:29:47

I’m embarrassed by what occurred I still can’t wrap my arms around it and I can tell you that those those people in that

4:29:53

Community deserve better than that all right

4:29:59

thank you any other new business any letters do we have any letters

4:30:07

do we have any old business uh if no one else does I would like to

4:30:15

commemorate no not yet um when I was on the FI the finance

4:30:21

committee um Paul and Helen hapgood used to often be the only people that would come to our

4:30:27

meetings and uh it’s unfortunate to hear of Mr hapkid’s passing his losses uh I’m

4:30:34

sure being felt by his family but it’s also a loss to our town government and certainly a loss to our community as a

4:30:41

whole and he will be missed and our condolences to his family

4:30:46

do we have a motion to adjourn Mr bletzer has moved Mr Mahoney has

4:30:52

seconded any objection seeing two of my colleagues already Rising I’ll call for

4:30:57

the vote Mr bletzer yes Mr Helm yes Mr Mahoney yes and myself yes we are

4:31:04

adjourned thank you